looking for suggestions on getting started

hi there

i've been wanting to make music for a while now, but i've never had enough time to sit down and learn how. i had a friend who had fruityloops, but he moved away so i only ever got to play around with it a few times. it looked bloody confusing, and he said it was one of the easier programs to use! this was about a year or two ago now as well, so it's probably changed even more..

i'd really like to use a keyboard as much as possible. we have this old keyboard (that i can tell is made much more for 'learning how to play the keyboard' than anything else) laying about that has midi capability, but that's about all i know about it. more details on it when its here infront of me (just moved house, its not with me right now)

if i was to try and use as much hardware/as little software as possible, other than an ACTUAL synthesizer, what else would i need?

well with those things in mind, what do you think the best steps to take would be?

  thief said:

fruityloops.

 

it looked bloody confusing

lol

sorry - er, sounds like you'd be better off with an actual do-it-all synthesizer or groovebox type thing - Roland MC-505's are good, a lot of people on here have Korg EM/ES/ERs, but I don't really rate them that much after owning an EM1 some years ago...

anyway - your best bet if you must have software is probably Fruity Loops or Ableton - Ableton (if you actually buy it) comes with some easy to follow tutorials on how to get started and you should be making tracks pretty rapidly if you follow them. You could use a MIDI controller keyboard/surface for either of these which would give you that "hands on" feel - Novation make some good controllers for beginners and aren't that expensive...

no-one can tell you how to make music - it's a creative process - you should try listening to stuff you like and try and imagine how the drums were programmed and where each bass hit/snare hit/keyboard riff sits in the overall track and maybe take some inspiration from that. if you really have no clue about time signatures/tempo/bars/steps etc then you should probably go to a music shop and get a book about basic musical theory that might help explain how tracks actually work from a technical point of view (e.g. what a 4/4 beat is and what that looks like musically).

fruity loops is good because it's all based on step sequences and you can see what you're putting where instantly and then listen to the result and change it accordingly..

I started out years ago using OctaMED tracker programme - Renoise is the modern day equivalent, but I would say that might get a little confusing for a beginner when you could use FLoops or Ableton instead.

personally, i would check out some of the more convincing vst's before you go out and blow a wad on hardware. it will give you a basic feel for how synths, modular shit, sequencers etc work, and will put you in a more informed position when you do come to buy hardware.

you really don't have to spend a fotune to get started. a good powerful pc with a decent soundcard and monitors is all you need to start, especially if you've already got a keyboard with midi.

get a cheap little pc to midi box, plug yr keyboard into yr pc, pirate some software and see what you like. try fuityloops and try a more traditional DAW like Cubase or Sonar. Try Ableton Live too. Music making interfaces are very personal things.

spend as much as you possibly can then flog it all to cash converters.

I can't tell if these threads are counter productive or not. To some degree I think that if you wanted to get started making music you would have already. But then again if you are trying to ask a bunch of electronic music producers the best way to start ahead of time, that might be pretty good planning.

I used to view electronic music and experimental electronic music as a sort of place dance musicians go when they get bored and jaded. It used to require a lot of skill to pull off some of the fancy tricks people were using back in the day, but now the tools have gotten so easy you can almost grab anything and use it to make insta electronic music.

I think there are some common school of thought regarding how to start making music properly. I notice a lot of people learn a sequencer and stick to it typically, however there are quite a few us (present company included) who tend to jump around quite a bit.

In general tho, I'd say if you wanted to focus on percussion and drums I'd lean towards learning a tracker like Renoise.

If (like you mentioned), you plan on making tonal music and using keys a lot, I'd lean towards learning a piano roll like FL Studio, Ableton, or Reason.

The reason why people typically recommend the later 3 is because that most of them in thier self contained format is enough to write tracks. They all have synths and drum machines and other essential tools needed to complete the job easily.

If you wanted to scout out exactly which vst's you might want for synthesis, drums, and fx, you could get away with just buying those and getting into a cheaper host such as energy xt.

People will recommend hardware, but for beginners I personally do not. Hardware is a commitment unless you plan on buying really cheap stuff or lease something. I'd download demos of FL Studio, Ableton, and Reason and see which one suites you better. Once you learn one of those three, it will be easy to expand your setup to include external instruments and other software.

Looking back, for me it really comes down to work flow. When I sit down at my studio, I want to be able to pump out a track in 3 hours if I'm really inspired. If the program isn't meshing with me properly, i can spend 3 hours just fighting with it.

Find out what works best for you based on demos.

  acid1 said:

If (like you mentioned), you plan on making tonal music and using keys a lot, I'd lean towards learning a piano roll like FL Studio, Ableton, or Reason.

Traditional DAW ftw! It has a piano roll, plus you don't have to break your music down into repeating patterns right from the get-go

  analogue wings said:

  acid1 said:

If (like you mentioned), you plan on making tonal music and using keys a lot, I'd lean towards learning a piano roll like FL Studio, Ableton, or Reason.

 

Traditional DAW ftw! It has a piano roll, plus you don't have to break your music down into repeating patterns right from the get-go

don't know about ableton or reason but you don't have to break your music down into repeating patterns in Floops, at all. i do tho, because i'm lazy.

i hopped on because i want to be a cool electronic music artist. from one beginner to another; i would say go with ableton and build up a collection of vsts and what not. of course try the others, but i've found that the ableton workspace makes everything a bit easier if you're new. learn what you can, and go from there.

ableton is fun and not as complicated as alot of other programs, and you can make complicated music with it just cause of the creative side of it and what you can do.

I write lots of melodic stuff in Renoise as I have in all the trackers I have used, I kinda hate the "for teh drumz" stigma that has been applied to it. That being said, if you're into trackers youll just gravitate to it and if not it's not worth mentioning. It's a love or hate kind of deal.

Ableton I'd recommend 'cause I use it but as most have said you can pretty much do good things with most sequencers providing you give them the time. Personally I'd say Ableton is the dog bollocks for cutting up breaks etc but not so hot for programming your own individual beats drum editor stylee.

  analogue wings said:

get a cheap little pc to midi box, plug yr keyboard into yr pc, pirate some software and see what you like. try fuityloops and try a more traditional DAW like Cubase or Sonar. Try Ableton Live too. Music making interfaces are very personal things.

agreed, buy a nice MIDI box and pirate Ableton and Reason (Audacity is excellent for sampling your soundcard), maybe Cubase or Traktor as well. if u want the maximum effect with the minimum of knowledge maybe pick up a KORG Mini Kaoss Pad, it gives excellent effects and all you have to know is how to move your finger.

Unless you're incredibly gifted, you still need to learn at least a little basic music theory so you're not completely lost when writing. Other than that, there are millions of things you can use. As intimidated as you might feel about sequencers and so forth, all of them do about the same thing. Just go with the one you feel is the most fun. After that, you'll be fine to move around to all tons others which will really switch how you work and really give you a fresher sound, for better or worse. I like to do that. I'll work on one, cram out a bunch of songs and then switch. It keeps it exciting.

Since you're starting off, I'll recommend Reason. It'll really help you understand what you're working with. You also won't have to go off looking for a bunch of different things; it's all included. Whatever you pick, make sure you go through the manual more than once. Stick with a subject until you feel comfortable enough to move on, or until you're bored.

You should really get some keyboard books, too. Unless you play another instrument... Learning to play will pay off if you stick with it.

Personally, I think FL Studio has the best interface for writing drums. It's just a huge step sequencer, and you can load in as many channels as you want.

If you want to try out a free tracker, try http://www.buzzmachines.com

It's pretty complicated, and you'll probably have to read the manual [as I did years ago], but you might like it. It didn't really suit me, so I didn't use it for long.

I think Synapse Orion has an much better interface for beginners than FL but without any music theory knowledge before hand you'll go nowhere, there's a few webpages that you can help you figure out some of the primary stuff.

http://forum.watmm.com/index.php?showtopic=30338

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/allsynthsecrets.htm

http://www.chordmaps.com/

from one beginner to another, save your money and start off with a nice midi keyboard and a copy of ableton live. then once you've learned your way around that start collecting vst's and you can make some nice really easy stuff in no time!

source: from a guy who spent a lot of money learning the hard way to making electronic music

don't get confused on technical stuff and try to play and record small melodies and melody based songs

then progress and find stuff that helps you to make these things sound better

Its the most part on how to develop a song and that can even be done on a sheet of paper

often people get more and more into gear to not have to deal with songwriting and to compensate their will to learn it properly they get lost in gear madness

try to avoid this pitfall from the beginning

If you can write a proper song on the piano or any other instrument you will have good results with any kind of equipment quite fast cause they are there to support you in doing that

don't try it the other way round or you will end up in the "bad music on expensive gear topic" one day

Don't get set into thinking you need to enter notes with a midi keyboard. You can draw them in or type them in with your PC keyboard if learning to play with piano keys seems daunting.

i still prefer to type in my midi notation than play it in with my keyboard.

My path was Rebirth -> Floops -> Hardware/Cubase SX3. It worked for me and everyone else I've dragged into this world of bleeps and bloops.

He's never coming back :cry2: