ableton live question

does it sound thin to your ears, and if so why do you think it does?

by thin i mean, unless you put a lot of effort into making a cpu intense chain of custom effectors, it will sound like a cheap toy? and even then, imo, a pretty basic Logic setup will sound deeper than any Live softsynth composition? why? WHY?

W H Y ?

It's probably all in your head. I can't imagine how any of the audio processors would differ in such a way.

Either way, if it sounds thin, it's most likely: low sampling rate (will effect any DAW), bad mastering (watch the spectrum!), or shitty VSTs.

hmmm yeah it's probably i'm a shit at mastering. i'ma running it at 96khz.... no vst's.

but still... i get the impression Live is packed with functionality, but the actual sound processing is kinda cheap.... for example, the impulse thing, it just sounds kind of... ya know... non-moving? also effects like auto filter.... nice sidechaining, but it's.... flaaaaat and lifeless?

need to learn mastering.

Ahhh no wonder, the built in instruments aren't the greatest.

I admit I have found a use for Operator, Analog, Drum Rack and Sampler, but the other ones aren't so great. They have uses as well but it really depends. You need to find VSTs that work with your sound.

And when you're making a track, an easy way to make the mastering easier is to have 2 returns: One with a low cut of about 400Hz, and the other with a high cut of 400Hz (make sure you use VST EQs, the Live ones suck: Waves has good ones for this: Lowband and Broadband). The number can of course be changed depending on how much of the lows you want your low synths to use, etc. Then send the instruments that create bass to the first return, and the instruments that make the main melodies to the second return. You can cut this into even more returns of course, if you want to isolate sounds between 400Hz and 800Hz, etc.

Then when you tweak the tracks, run spectrum on them to see where you want to cut frequencies on each individual instrument before it is sent to the return track.

Finally, after this is done, run spectrum through the master track and try to make the frequency spectrum as flat as possible. Once it's flat it should sound pretty great, but depending on the style/mood of the song you may want to cut mids, etc (try not to ever boost frequencies, cut them instead).

This'll create more depth and allow each instrument to have a good part of the frequency spectrum.

Good luck!

Every single synth and effect in logic is jam packed with compression and EQing from the moment you open it. I prefer having a choice.

It's like, why do you put this shit on the synth, how could you ever know what works best for my track. everything that starts out "clean" is going to sound thinner of course, but you'll have more fun sculpting it into something that works perfect for your jams.

Impulse depends on the samples you use.. logic has some crazh realistic drum samples, but there are library VSTs to buy for that.

  Quote

Finally, after this is done, run spectrum through the master track and try to make the frequency spectrum as flat as possible. Once it's flat it should sound pretty great, but depending on the style/mood of the song you may want to cut mids, etc (try not to ever boost frequencies, cut them instead).

 

This'll create more depth and allow each instrument to have a good part of the frequency spectrum.

Stupidest thing i ever heard.. and every painting should contain equal amounts of light and darkness, right?

  chimera slot mom said:

Every single synth and effect in logic is jam packed with compression and EQing from the moment you open it. I prefer having a choice.

 

It's like, why do you put this shit on the synth, how could you ever know what works best for my track. everything that starts out "clean" is going to sound thinner of course, but you'll have more fun sculpting it into something that works perfect for your jams.

afaik from having been a logic user since 1999 none of their synths or effects are compressed or eq'd. Unless you are referring to their Instrument Racks which are really just presets of synths and effects combined. It's not necessary to use those and they weren't even added into Logic until recently (couple years now)

granted a couple of the synths do have delay, reverb, eq built in, but you don't have to enable it.

apart from all that, i'd have to agree with the previous posts that if you think ableton sounds thin, it's most likely a result of the sounds and effects you are choosing to use.

abe does sound thin. been saying that for ages. audio summing is peculiar - been the same since v4.

i still love it.

  chimera slot mom said:

Every single synth and effect in logic is jam packed with compression and EQing from the moment you open it. I prefer having a choice.

 

It's like, why do you put this shit on the synth, how could you ever know what works best for my track. everything that starts out "clean" is going to sound thinner of course, but you'll have more fun sculpting it into something that works perfect for your jams.

 

Impulse depends on the samples you use.. logic has some crazh realistic drum samples, but there are library VSTs to buy for that.

 

  Quote

Finally, after this is done, run spectrum through the master track and try to make the frequency spectrum as flat as possible. Once it's flat it should sound pretty great, but depending on the style/mood of the song you may want to cut mids, etc (try not to ever boost frequencies, cut them instead).

 

This'll create more depth and allow each instrument to have a good part of the frequency spectrum.

Stupidest thing i ever heard.. and every painting should contain equal amounts of light and darkness, right?

Uhhh any good painting will have the light and the dark balanced... There are exceptions but generally that rule stands. The composition is important, but so is the balance. But whatever if you don't think so, lol, what can I say? One question though, have you ever even analyzed any electronic music, or took any courses/talked to anyone who has taken music engineering courses? Because if you think it's stupid to balance the frequency spectrum, you must think music engineering school is stupid as well.

Just incase you're too lazy to look into it, here are some frequency spectrums of well mastered songs:

I picked areas where there were no drums etc, because then the entire spectrum becomes a lot flatter.

But either way, a general flatness can be observed in all these songs (especially after the bass frequencies), and in general I'd say 90% of well mastered tracks will have a very similiar looking frequency spectrum.

There will always be exceptions, and they may still sound good, but a general rule for any starting electronic musician is to watch this and make sure no frequencies are taking over other ones.