thinking of starting a netlabel

So a friend and I are thinking of starting a netlabel. Basically I'm wondering what you all's thoughts are regarding netlabels in general. So please feel free to answer the below questions or just opine in general— any thoughts you have will be really helpful.

1. There's already a shitload of free music on the Internet at this point and that's not even counting illegal downloads. What has to happen for you to decide to pay attention to a particular netlabel? Specifically:

- I really want to focus on sound quality. I would want to offer FLACs of everything (it seems like bandcamp already makes this very easy, or I would just encode multiple ways and host on some "official" torrents with maybe S3 as a backup). I want to "master" all the recordings myself (or at least pay attention to how they are mastered so they all "jive" soundwise together. Does this excite you?

- I want to have swanky design with big good embedded album art and a coherent website (thinner.cc is currently my favorite netlabel website, please suggest other good ones if you know them). I really like getting new physical music when the packaging is nice or unique, for example, and lately I've been really into finding fun/lush/interesting album art to embed into iTunes instead of just settling for whatever shitty thumbnail I can find on Google. Say there's some BADASS artwork at the top of the page ... do you download the EP/album/etc and give it a try?

- I want to somehow get some artists that people care about. By that I mean, maybe some people we all know for burning up EKT, or people with releases on real labels with side-projects or tracks that didn't make 'big' releases, whatever. I know this might be difficult to do, but if you see a person you recognize, do you suddenly care about Joe Schmo netlabel?

- I want to make it easy to get the stuff. Nice writeups, RSS feed, etc etc. Say I pop up in your Google reader, write something charming and humorous, describe sassily what an EP sounds like, and give you a link. Do you check it out?

2. It's 2009. Do you look down on netlabels because they do not produce physical goods? I know that I sometimes find myself writing off music that is free online because 'if it was good enough, it would be a physical release on a *real* label'. There's no good reason to feel that way here in 2009 but I still do sometimes, involuntarily. Is this a factor?

3. Similarly, do you look down on free music in general? ie. 'If it was good, it would cost money?' Again, I know that you probably don't do this on PURPOSE, but do you find yourself feeling skeptical of free shit nevertheless?

4. Does how a website is designed play into your perception of any of this? I mean, I could design a site with a bunch of Ruby shit and some fancy S3 blah blah on there, but it would also look probably just as styling with a custom WordPress theme and a link to a nice Bandcamp page, maybe with a SoundCloud player on there for fun as well. Say the website looks good either way, does the fact that it's built on some prefab "easy" shit vs. some hip "custom" shit affect how you perceive it at all?

5. You're a musician and some random dude emails you asking if you want to do a netlabel release because I like your music. You check things out and my website is pretty nice and elegant and the other releases are interesting, etc. Do you say yes? Are there other things you are interested in besides that? Do you require certain things? Do you NOT want your music released in a lossless format for some reason? Again, assume it looks like I've put a little work in and the site is good, there are other tracks up, etc. What else goes into your decision?

6. How much do you care about 'from the vaults'-style releases, or DJ mixes, or archival 'releases' (say, a mix of really weird 45s for example) vs. actual artist releases that are EPs and albums? Do you care about 'digital singles' (2 or 3 tracks only), or do you want to bother only with releases that are EP size or larger? Is it possible for a release to be daunting or a turn-off because it's TOO large (say, a 20-track various artists comp, or a two-hour ambient release)? Is anything like this a factor?

Well, that's about all I can think about right now. Thanks a LOT for reading, guys and gals, cheers ...

Peter ASCDI

just do it. people will download it. if its good then they'll download more and tell other people.

if it sucks then rename it metropublik

wordpress no. build a website.

NOOOOOOOO

DON'T DO IT

Yeah I mean, I fuck around with Wordpress and it's like, yeah, this does stuff. I can post words and pictures, good enough for me. But I'm also like mehhhh, this is kind of like the Geocities of the 21st century with attendant stigma attached. AND YET, I can't think of a legit technical reason to want more features than what Wordpress or any similar easy framework does. Is it just a matter of web cred or is there a good reason?

well personally i haven't used wordpress. if you can make it look completely how you want then use it sure. if it looks like the planet mu website then get a crack design/development team to build a website.

design is a massive part of the net label. the site is very important because you got no physical art. get it right i say.

maybe i underestimate wordpress but i'm guessing it looks like a web2.0 blog

I agree. For WP, as far as I know you can just CSS it however you want. It's all the back-end-ish stuff that's cool like approving comments and administering from the app on my iPod touch or whatever that makes it appealing to me.

The Mu website is definitely not awesome, but it's also just needlessly complex, to me. All I think you really need are News, Discography, and in their case, a board. To me a netlabel is basically an RSS feed (news and new releases) and some way to browse the back catalog and archive of releases. And maybe a contact page. That's three pages!

Make the website easy to use/navigate.

Don't use wordpress if you can help it. It just looks blah.

I love embedded artwork. So nice.

COhesive sound is nice...you know what you can expect from a label. At the same time, it doesn't hurt to evolve the sound or focus of the label over time.

Hi chen! I do need to really investigate the WP thing and see if it's stuck in blog world or if it can look cool, etc. My question was mainly, aside from how good it does or does not look, is there some stigma attached to it? So far it sounds like the answer is no, not really. As long as it looks good.

And I agree with what you said about the sound. In my head I'm more focused on the cohesiveness on like, a micro level or something. Like I want to make sure everything sounds good and feels good together in a vague sense, but genre-wise it would be a large variety of things. Again, in my head. ;)

I am a label boss. It's worth it just so you can say that daily.

Do it. And release my shit. I've been shopping for a netlabel recently to do a release, but most of the places that I run into are either out of commission or never get back to me.

Fred: Points. Can I call myself a label "don"? That also works right?

'ntree: Cool, is your music good? Obviously none of this is happening yet, but send me a link?

It's a wonderful pain in the ass. We're working on our 10 year anniversary release. You do have to maintain quality control though... I recieve ALOT of submissions for my netlabel, and it's sad to say, but I have to turn down alot... I do think people think less of netlabels, as if they're not "real" labels, I even think it myself, sometimes I'll recieve a submission for a release and think to myself, "this stuff is so bad, even a netlabel wouldn't release it".

But, if you love the music, and the scene it's associated with, it can be very enjoyable, but to do it right, it takes alot of work. ...and you'll have to listen to alot of bad music.

i typically beg people to release on my label.

As a consumer I rarely purchase mp3s. I tend to find most things I want on CD or vinyl used or at a fair price, usually below the cost of an mp3 album. Occasionally I slsk something if it's out of print.

I'll admit that labels that do offer physical releases are more likely to catch my attention. This is often because of better promotion to recoup their costs in sales, i.e. by magazine ads, reviews, and articles. Most physical publications exclusively review physical releases. Also, labels that release physical releases are putting money up front and investing in artists, which shows they feel they are putting out a quality product (even when they aren't sometimes!).

I download free mp3s all the time, usually legally and sometimes off blogs. This is more to hear what something sounds like rather than to acquire something for regular listening on my mp3 player. I usually lose track of these mp3s over time, lost in whatever folders.

A net label is more likely to catch my attention if the site looks nice and there is decent artwork/design with the releases. Of course the production of the releases should also be quality. The appearance of the web site is important as well, which indicates that whoever is running it gives a shit. It's also important for a good written description of the release and the artist, to make it worthwhile for the consumer to take the time to download the release.

As an artist, I prefer to release physical releases and mp3s, with as wide of distribution as possible. Currently a label that does physical and mp3 releases is planning to release some of my music, and they are tied with a large distributor. To me this is ideal. I'm not so concerned with money as exposure, and this fits that.

I have in the past released a net only release with a label. That label really impressed me in its professionalism. Also, they did a big promotional push for the release, which was on a compilation, and the compilation can be purchased just about anywhere that sells mp3s. I felt this was very good for exposure, especially as a first release.

Another net-only label, that exclusively releases on Beatport, wants to release my music as well. I have put them at lower priority, since the limited distribution equals limited exposure for my music.

As far as free releases, I would only release single tracks of mine for free as a promotion, for instance on a fairly well known publication, web site or blog.

I still think a net label is a viable option, as long as it's done professionally and with quality control. Success with a net label can lead to physical releases eventually too, if the demand was there. Keep in mind I don't think I'm the typical consumer - I'm older and probably a dying breed that still buys CDs and vinyl. Net labels are probably the future of the business, so yeah, start one today. Just make sure you go all the way with it and don't half step.

Two of my favorite electronic websites, Deepchord and 12K, seem to use mp3s for more experimental and/or promotional purposes. I think that fits the throw-away nature of mp3 files. When you have something that is quality it should be on vinyl or cassette.

Thanks for the info and opinions, dudes. EDGEY, what is your label? I'd like to check it out and see what you're up to.

s-cones, nice on the musical success. Have I heard your stuff? What name do you work under?

Cheers,

www.envmod.com

  Quote

I want to somehow get some artists that people care about. By that I mean, maybe some people we all know for burning up EKT, or people with releases on real labels with side-projects or tracks that didn't make 'big' releases, whatever. I know this might be difficult to do, but if you see a person you recognize, do you suddenly care about Joe Schmo netlabel?

-it helps if there is some sort of connection to names I know

-shorter albums that I can listen to all the way through without skipping tracks are better than long albums stuffed with filler sound design experiments

-as well as a website, consider registering yourself as a 'label' on last.fm and uploading the catalogue to there - you can then track plays and do neat stuff like 'powerplay' promos where you target your tracks to fans of similar artists.

i'll like your idea if you release something of mine on it, heheh.

basically, what i like in a weblabel is somewhere that will host my tracks, can get me a decent amount of exposure, and doesn't fuck with my artwork. laridae insisted on using this:

instead of this:

> modey.

yeah man that's retarded. the artwork/packaging for microleaps is really really good, the weblabel version is nowhere near as good/original.

A well designed, functional site, ability to stream mp3 previews, and beautiful artwork go a long way for me. Oh, and not too many artists on your roster. I tend to browse a label's site more if there aren't an overwhelming number of artists listed. It shows some selection by the label bosses.

Cool, cool. Modey, I'm definitely a fan of your stuff, as you know.

Part of the reason I'm hesitating a little is that while I do have a passion for music, artworks, web design, and stuff, I have much less passion and basically no instinct for promotion. I've never been good at that.

& to be honest until right now I didn't really think about how once someone gives you music to release, you sort of owe it to them to do your best promoting their shit. I have a few ideas about how I'd proceed with promotion, but I probably need a more concrete plan in place for how I'm going to get things out there before I begin sinking a lot of time into this.

On the plus side I tried out Bandcamp last night, just out of curiosity, and it's really great. They're not exactly set up for per-label (as opposed to per-artist) use yet, but the design, upload and download shit, and format conversion shit are totally dope.

  Ascdi said:

Thanks for the info and opinions, dudes. EDGEY, what is your label? I'd like to check it out and see what you're up to.

Cheers,

Here you go: http://www.darkstep.org

It started 10 years ago (the website did anyway), prior to that is was a hyperreal mailing list. There was a physical CD release in 2001. I ran a small forum on the site for quite a few years, and met dozens of producers, and a small community formed, and everyone was generally supportive of each other, often sharing production techniques, and offering constructive criticism, so there's a plenty of "good vibes", given that everyone typically writes dark music...

Everyone so often, I'd get a dozen or so tracks from forum members and put out a ZIP file with some printable artwork and 320 mp3s, so I think the netlabel concept just sort of happened, it wasn't planned.

So I have no idea on how to start one from scratch, ours just sort of evolved into a netlabel.

Here's a couple links:

http://www.discogs.com/label/darkstep.org

Releases:

http://www.darkstep.org/releases.asp

I'm open to suggestions myself, as I'm really doing this by the seat of my pants.

it is tough to tell someone that sends you a completed release that its not good enough. are you ready to do that?

i'm probably cynical, but i say that there are too many netlabels, i really don't bother with any of them ...