Yo Renoise Peeps

We're starting Longtrack 2. I'll be done with the first section in a day or two.

website

thread on the Renoise forum

Also, Renoise rules. Profess your love for it.

can someone explain to me the specific reasons why breakcore artists like renoise the best?

or just why i would want to use renoise instead of ableton or logic?

It's fast and precise and I don't have to spend the whole time clicking shit with my mouse. Fuck a mouse. Keyboard ftw.

I love the hell out of Ableton, but I lose a lot of interest in programming with it because the piano roll on it blows. The only quality PR is in FL Studio, and there's a lot about the way FL does things that I just can't stand.

Renoise is fast, intuitive, and powerful, and it has a wicked development team that listens to the input of its users.

Really the only things that keep me from uninstalling Ableton are variable scope and recording audio tracks. It sucks to have a limited grid/scale of view in Renoise. They're adding zooming soon, though, hopefully. It'll be awesome if they allow the ability to zoom in to the tick level (ticks divide lines, lines divide beats, beats divide patterns, patterns divide the song). It also sucks to only kinda be able to record audio. There's talk of adding that as well though.

Edit: Does anyone else find Ableton's clip view uninspiring as far as building and structuring songs goes? I feel like I should feel free when using it, but I just feel boxed into loops. Loops loops loops. I generally dislike loops.

I use both. But I don't rewire just because I can't be arsed fiddling about. Renoise is tits because you can chop and re-arrange a break into 5 other breaks in about 2 minutes and then chuck 'em into Ableton to jam them onto the ends of other breaks for a bit of variation. Ableton is taint-ticklingly good because I can arrange a track in about half an hour by shuffling wee coloured boxes around. The only thing I can't be bothered with (or bothered learning) is how to arrange an entire track in Renoise.. I just can't seem to get my head around pattern by pattern songwriting, I have to see it as a whole in Ableton and be able(ton) to simply throw stuff around with my computer arrow pointing device. It's probably just an illusion of freedom really but what an illusion. closer to copperfield than blaine (way ahead of criss angel).

  On 5/15/2010 at 1:27 PM, edge said:

I just can't seem to get my head around pattern by pattern songwriting, I have to see it as a whole in Ableton and be able(ton) to simply throw stuff around with my computer arrow pointing device.

Yeah, see I just think in patterns. Loops have always bothered me, as I usually like to have little fills/transitions/non-repeating sections that are different each time, which would mean that I'd have to either a) make two different clips, or b) make fill clips that need to be launched at whatever point during the main clips for the part, which seems super roundabout. I can just program them in in 2 seconds in Renoise. Easy. I feel like Ableton would be awesome for that kind of stuff still though, but it just doesn't click with me anymore.

Also I spend forever tweaking sounds unproductively in Ableton.

I use both ableton and renoise, but I only use the arrangement view in ableton. The clip view disgusts me.

i've used tracker based sequencers since scream tracker 3, can't stand piano roll, and renoise is awesome in every way (though a "zoom" function would be great), and much like wahrk, i can't stand just looping stuff over and over, i always fiddle about with small details in every pattern that noone notices but me.

Yeah seriously, fuck clip view. I can definitely see where it could be useful (the "Live" part of Ableton Live), but for building tracks it's arrangement view all the way.

Glad that so many other people feel this way. Whew. Maybe I'll start trying to use Ableton Rewired to Renoise.

I despise Ableton's clip view as well, it just plain confuses me.

As to renoise, this has inspired me to fiddle with it again, now that I at least somewhat understand the songwriting process... It was definitely interesting, even if it didn't make a lick of sense to me seven or eight months ago.

how can you people not like the clip view in ableton? its the most innovative way of working ever.

people think to linearly, and you know what happens? its make your music predictable.

its called live because it does stuff live. why bother arranging a track when you can get the clip view to arrange it for you in a way you'd never have thought of.

step out of the 90s people.

geeze.

really? I mean... come on... really?

edit: shuffling loops>partiture?

  On 5/20/2010 at 2:04 PM, Gocab said:

shuffling loops>partiture?

what?

Songs happen linearly. Yeah, the clip view is awesome for live performance with all the permutations you can create, but a finished track includes only one permutation, so it's kind of unnecessary for production not aimed at live use.

  On 5/20/2010 at 12:28 PM, winky said:

how can you people not like the clip view in ableton? its the most innovative way of working ever.

Pssst. If anyone's interested, the project this thread was initially about is still happening.

i've never even really got my feet wet with ableton live and don't intend to... i love renoise and am not advanced enough to know what i'm missing out on

  On 9/12/2010 at 11:07 PM, tht tne said:

i've never even really got my feet wet with ableton live and don't intend to... i love renoise and am not advanced enough to know what i'm missing out on

real audio tracks, somewhat more precise automation, MIDI effects, racks, clip view (yeah okay whatevs)

not a lot of serious stuff, just stuff that's often handy. It's nothing you can't get around in Renoise most of the time.

i always use clip view to just create mutations of clips for a track, and then arrange them linearly in arrange view. Once you copy a clip over there it's an independent entity and you can tweak and add ghost notes to your IDM heart's content. :p

You can also easily build a track in clip view using follow actions.

Can renoise send out midi to hardware?

yes

I use both in there entirety. I love session view but also start many tracks in arrange.

Its not fair to compare Ableton and Renoise. Ableton isn't even a tracker, and Renoise isn't really designed for live use.

*queue the idiot who is gonna correct me and tell me how the matrix in Renoise is all anyone will ever need ever to do live shows with bands and whatever else forever into eternity*

  On 9/14/2010 at 10:08 PM, acid1 said:

I use both in there entirety. I love session view but also start many tracks in arrange.

 

Its not fair to compare Ableton and Renoise. Ableton isn't even a tracker, and Renoise isn't really designed for live use.

 

*queue the idiot who is gonna correct me and tell me how the matrix in Renoise is all anyone will ever need ever to do live shows with bands and whatever else forever into eternity*

They're different but they are both designed for making music. I'd say that they're comparable as long as you choose criteria. For me, that's transparency when producing. The less I think about and have to deal with the program and/or computer, then the more focus I can put towards the music. Likewise, the faster I can put my ideas into the program, the more options I can try and more ideas I can retain before I get fatigued. That's why I like Renoise.

For Live stuff, I think Live is superior hands down, but I don't even play live at this point, and for my workflow, realtime live composition is not an option.

im still baffled by how someone could make a really good finished track in Abelton compared to a program like Logic or Cubase, it feels way underdeveloped compared to those two. Fruity i can understand i've seen people do it.

  On 9/14/2010 at 11:06 PM, Awepittance said:

im still baffled by how someone could make a really good finished track in Abelton compared to a program like Logic or Cubase, it feels way underdeveloped compared to those two. Fruity i can understand i've seen people do it.

As long as it hosts VSTs and has a basic mixer, you can make do with just about any host for mixing and whatnot. My problem is the actual composition. The piano roll in Ableton is sub-par for programming an adequate level of minutia quickly and accurately.

I don't know how I feel about Fl Studio's mixer. Cubase seems to have a large learning curve and is soooo extensive. I reeeeaaaally want to try Logic. For all of these though, they're a notch down in my book due to the multiple windows. Not a fan.

  On 9/14/2010 at 11:47 PM, wahrk said:

The piano roll in Ableton is sub-par for programming an adequate level of minutia quickly and accurately.

 

i agree i also have similar issues with it's audio editing timeline features, they work and you have the bread and butter but it has like 50% of the features that logic and cubase does for editing/splicing audio

i really really badly ant to wrap my head around how to use a vertical keyboard based tracker, it's so confusing to me. Are there good 'getting started' tutorials for it?