High End AD/DA

Hey guys and girls!

I've decided it's time to turn my fidelity up a notch. My requirements are 2 x input and 8 x output with the best fidelity possible for around $2k.

I'm confused as shit, though, about what I need to get in addition to just a high-end AD/DA converter. What other components are needed to get the input/output into/out of the DAW, and how do they work? Do I need to worry about clock? Is DSD a workable solution?

Etc, etc...

Your advice is greatly appreciated.

I would be surprised if more than 3 people on watmm have <> two thousand dollar AD/DA's or much experience with them so hopefully they show up. Haha

Didn't you mentioned you owned a Manley compressor/limiter? Where are you getting the funds for these incredible investments? Can you show me the way? Can you at least point in the right direction?

trust fund?

lol

rosetta

its cheap and what you need

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Rosetta200/

Nice, yeah, that's hella cheap dawg. I'm buying one right now with my spare change.

i've got three. i used to have four but i just threw one away for the heck of it.

Lol @ the bitter unemployed fucks.

Lol @ the bitter notion that I don't make my own cash!

Anyway, I don't own the $12000 worth of tube gear in my house. It's on loan from another bitter, unemployed fuck.

Thanks for the Rosetta tip. I'm tracking one down, used, on ebay right now.

(speaking for myself)) I'm not unemployed and also not bitter, but maybe a tad jealous although I am quite happy using software for most of my production needs. Just joshing around with my sincere questions in sincere curiosity. More power to you, I will listen to more of the Raid EP sometime in the near future.

That being said I wouldn't think any less of a person that is rich because of trust funds (I would if they were a dumb, talentless, snobby, bitchy cunt though)

"You're not your job.. you're not your fucking khakis" and what not

I'm not unemployed or bitter either.

  On 2/11/2011 at 8:25 PM, BCM said:

I'm not unemployed or bitter either.

Your suggestion that I'm handed everything by my estate says you are, at the very least, bitter.

  On 2/11/2011 at 8:19 PM, Blanket Fort Collapse said:

(speaking for myself)) I'm not unemployed and also not bitter, but maybe a tad jealous although I am quite happy using software for most of my production needs. Just joshing around with my sincere questions in sincere curiosity. More power to you, I will listen to more of the Raid EP sometime in the near future.

 

That being said I wouldn't think any less of a person that is rich because of trust funds (I would if they were a dumb, talentless, snobby, bitchy cunt though)

 

"You're not your job.. you're not your fucking khakis" and what not

Cheers. And for the record, I have no idea how to afford the Manley and Avalon gear. I'm just so fricking thankful to have it in my home (for now).

relax mang I was only yanking your chain... :)

i am an ultra skeptic when it comes to a noticeably quality difference between a $200 a/D converter and a $2000 one. It seems like it gives you even more diminishing returns than most other high end audio stuff.

i've tried really nice a/D and to be honest i think it's a waste of money to focus so much on that part of your setup unless it's a drop in the bucket for you monetarily. Even still having a $2,000 new Roland Vsynth would be a lot cooler than something that does A/D

  On 2/11/2011 at 10:01 PM, Awepittance said:

i am an ultra skeptic when it comes to a noticeably quality difference between a $200 a/D converter and a $2000 one. It seems like it gives you even more diminishing returns than most other high end audio stuff.

 

i've tried really nice a/D and to be honest i think it's a waste of money to focus so much on that part of your setup unless it's a drop in the bucket for you monetarily. Even still having a $2,000 new Roland Vsynth would be a lot cooler than something that does A/D

Everything you do in a hardware studio must pass through this...how is it not important?

I think he says the audible difference is negligible.

Wrong question.

If you want 2x input with 8x output at the best possible fidelity for $2,000 then what you're really asking is recommend me a very decent audio interface. The new RME has had nothing but rave reviews, might find it somewhere for $2000, maybe a bit more.

Stand alone high quality A/D and D/A are invariably stereo and usually used in different circumstances, such as in mastering and monitoring chains i.e. you're mixing using a summing box or analogue mixer and need to get the mixdown back into the digital domain. There are countless choices, but Burl Audio Bomber units are getting rave reviews as 'character' A/D and D/A.

I have no experience of the above recommendations.

My advice would be that unless everything else in the audio and monitoring chain is shit hot, including room acoustics, then you'd be wasting your money on standalone D/A and A/D.

  On 2/11/2011 at 10:36 PM, acidphakist said:

  On 2/11/2011 at 10:01 PM, Awepittance said:

i am an ultra skeptic when it comes to a noticeably quality difference between a $200 a/D converter and a $2000 one. It seems like it gives you even more diminishing returns than most other high end audio stuff.

 

i've tried really nice a/D and to be honest i think it's a waste of money to focus so much on that part of your setup unless it's a drop in the bucket for you monetarily. Even still having a $2,000 new Roland Vsynth would be a lot cooler than something that does A/D

 

 

Everything you do in a hardware studio must pass through this...how is it not important?

well clearly it is important, and everyone with a $200+ soundcard already has a decent quality A/D. In my mind if you aren't a diminishing returns addicted audiophile (you dont seem to be) the only reason to get an additional A/D box, say 8channel rack for your studio is to be able to utilize the Lightpipe/spdif/AES ins on your soundcard

Right now i'm using a very low end 8 channel a/d, it cost me $175 to use a bunch of gear that i've been neglecting and its already wired for recording in my soundcard, i basically doubled the amount of analog channels i can use at once. To me this should be the focus for a person who owns a studio that is not a multi millionaire, if you have money to burn then sure buy $4,000 a/D boxes, $5,000 compressors and notice that your music will often sound just as well produced as someone with the right skill set who knows how to use the Waves plugin suite on their $500 computer

and what the poster right below you said is what i meant in case there is any confusion.

  On 2/11/2011 at 10:46 PM, kakapo said:

 

My advice would be that unless everything else in the audio and monitoring chain is shit hot, including room acoustics, then you'd be wasting your money on standalone D/A and A/D.

good points, if you are the type of quality minded person who just wants the greatest and best gear then you shouldn't just be focusing on a very high end A/D because yeah, if you're using low end everything else then the actual audible difference will probably be completely undetectable. To me its one of the 'last' things you should be worrying about getting top tier in a studio once you have everything else well taken care of (monitors, room treatment, preamps)

edit: but i've had discussions many times with friends who swear by insanely expensive A/D converter, more often than not i feel like they are really just trying to justify the money spent rather than being honest with themselves.

edit2: in short if you want to take your 'quality up a notch' i think it would be wiser to look elsewhere

Awepittance:

One might make the case that you are trying to justify NOT buying better AD/DA conversion. Why should my prime directive be to have 16 or more low quality AD/DA at once instead of 8 high quality AD/DA? I don't track 16 things at once. Furthermore, it's apparent you've never had the opportunity to use quality outboard processors when you make arguments that $500 worth of plugs will render the same sound.

Kakapo:

My signal chain IS shit hot. The weak link is, in fact, the prosumer-grade AD/DA that EVERYTHING must pass through. Please explain to me how tight room acoustics have ANYTHING to do with crystal clear recordings? You are confusing mixing/mastering with recording.

"Stand alone high quality A/D and D/A are invariably stereo and usually used in different circumstances"

Not true at all. Do some research. I can provide links to products that defy you, if you'd like.

PS-

I'd like to head this off at the pass because I can already feel it coming, Awepittance, but no! I'm not somebody that thinks throwing money at gear makes better music.

I just figured I'd better burn your strawman.

  On 2/11/2011 at 11:14 PM, acidphakist said:

Furthermore, it's apparent you've never had the opportunity to use quality outboard processors when you make arguments that $500 worth of plugs will render the same sound.

 

since you've gotten defensive and tried to represent me in a false light for seemingly no reason ....

fuck off, i have a bachelors degree in audio sciences, i've probably used a lot more of this high end gear than you have

that being said, i could make a similar off base judgement about you form afar too and i will: you've don't have confidence in yourself to use modest tools to make your music sound good, instead you rely on a high price take to somehow build your music ego up thinking magically its going to make your stuff more appealing, in reality this insecurity lies in your own lack of learnt skills

  On 2/11/2011 at 11:25 PM, Awepittance said:

  On 2/11/2011 at 11:14 PM, acidphakist said:

Furthermore, it's apparent you've never had the opportunity to use quality outboard processors when you make arguments that $500 worth of plugs will render the same sound.

 

 

fuck off, i could make a similar off base judgement about you form afar too and i will: you've never had the opportunity to learn to develop the skills to use the tools and instead rely on the price tag to make you feel better.

LOL I knew you'd try and go there. I'm glad I nipped that in the bud...

  On 2/11/2011 at 11:22 PM, acidphakist said:

PS-

 

I'd like to head this off at the pass because I can already feel it coming, Awepittance, but no! I'm not somebody that thinks throwing money at gear makes better music.

 

I just figured I'd better burn your strawman.

i think you took me too personally there buddy, i was not saying you were this person. I was trying to say where i think one's priorities should be on a modest budget when looking at new studio components to by.

and yeah read my fuck off message above if you want

nipped what in the bud? the lies you told?

edit: not everyone here is 'jealous' of your ability to buy expensive gear my friend, although it seems you want to project that view for whatever reason.

apologies to everyone else for my outburst, when someone argues that something being more expensive equals better in the audio world it kind of sets me off

  On 2/11/2011 at 11:14 PM, acidphakist said:

 

Kakapo:

 

My signal chain IS shit hot. The weak link is, in fact, the prosumer-grade AD/DA that EVERYTHING must pass through. Please explain to me how tight room acoustics have ANYTHING to do with crystal clear recordings? You are confusing mixing/mastering with recording.

 

You're asking about DA as well as AD. That implies you're concerned about your monitoring chain, not just your recording chain.

  On 2/11/2011 at 11:14 PM, acidphakist said:

 

"Stand alone high quality A/D and D/A are invariably stereo and usually used in different circumstances"

 

Not true at all. Do some research. I can provide links to products that defy you, if you'd like.

It may simply be a question of terminology/semantics, but you need to clarify exactly what you're asking for advice on. Stand alone high quality AD and DA units are usually used in the scenarios I mentioned. Devices that combine multichannel AD and DA are usually referred to as an 'interface', and more often than not will have some direct way of interfacing with a computer, or as an option. Yes there are individual multi channel AD and DA devices as well, but that doesn't seem to be what you're asking about. Usually they'd be used as adding additional analogue or digital inputs to an existing 'interface'.

My advice stands. If you want high quality multichannel AD/DA for $2,000 look at high end 'audio interfaces', something like the new RME or a multichannel Apogee or Lynx if the budget can stretch.