Meditation

For a long time I've been resisting to actually pay attention to anything (transcendental) meditation related even though there has been that growing fad of people I respect like David Lynch saying how great it is and how it can change your life. I've been really skeptical with the subject for two simple reasons:

*Doubts whether it can actually work or being another result of the placebo effect or at worse a scam people invented to get as much money as possible from other people.

*The connection with any religions and/or cults etc. which have no purpose or meaning in my life.

Yet I've read (in this forum too) about some very positive experiences from people who seemed pretty decent, honest and unbiased i.e neither religiously brainwashed or scammers and I've decided to approach the whole thing with good faith and try it to give it a go. I think it was in this forum where someone encouraged someone else to "put all the religious crap aside and meditation can really do wonders for you if you try". I never truly reject anything before I experience it myself anyway.

So I'd like some help from people who have been practicing it and actually being benefited from it.

My questions are:

1. The reason I decided to give meditation a try is because I've heard you can be greatly benefited if you got stress, panic attack, insomnia, concentration, low attention span, depression issues and even boost your creativity/productivity. Is that true? Could I be benefited from it?

2. Most importantly, where do I start? I'd really appreciate if someone could recommend me a decent site I could check and follow directions. Or even a video series / dvd I could watch.

Who knows, maybe I discover I have been really missing something great. Thanks!

here's a great place to start according to a lot of people: http://www.urbandharma.org/udharma4/mpe.html

Meditation can be beneficial, but ( from my own experience) it takes time, practice and patience. When i was at the pinnacle of my panic attacks/anxiety i went to this pseudo-psychologist guy that helped me "master" meditation, i could see some benefits right away (less/not as aggressive panic attacks) but i just lost patience and decided not to continue with meditation (a decision i regret).

Just be careful about online medication websites, lots of scammers out there. I would recommend to go to forums instead of websites that offers help. There is a lot of resources here - http://www.dreamviews.com/forum.php (i know is mainly about Lucid Dreaming but there is ton of stuff on meditation as well)

I will also recommend you to listen to Sam Harris talk about meditation, he is a bit if an aggressive cunt most of the time, but somehow listening to him talk about meditation gives a lot of skeptics belief in meditation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8U5J_LV3UI

Just listen to music.

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Just listen to music.

Oh but i do!

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Just be careful about online medication websites, lots of scammers out there.

Yeah, that's the thing that's why I ask for help from people who have been successfully practicing it.

I wanna reach for the genuine stuff above the bogus. That means that anything asking for my paypal or trying to shove religious entities and figures down my throat will only drive me away from the whole thing.

The official TM classes cost around $2000. I went another direction after I found that out.

I do it. And Im not a religious person.

There are different meditation methods, is something like picking a DAW

I recommend you mantra meditation, you can read a good book like this:

http://books.google.com.ar/books?id=JgnTT0eqwIoC&lpg=PP1&ots=0sHhYvjSU1&dq=Meditation%20and%20Mantras&hl=es&pg=PP1#v=onepage&q&f=false

as the author said, mantras are not secret and not for sell, something that some famous "gurus" do in the states

i find it good to focus, calm down, just for that it deserves the effort

I'm actually planning on taking TM classes once my instructor returns to the US. I too was skeptical at first (and still am to some extent), but I'm keeping an open mind going in.

  On 4/8/2012 at 12:50 AM, capitan mission said:

I do it. And Im not a religious person.

There are different meditation methods, is something like picking a DAW

I recommend you mantra meditation, you can read a good book like this:

http://books.google.com.ar/books?id=JgnTT0eqwIoC&lpg=PP1&ots=0sHhYvjSU1&dq=Meditation%20and%20Mantras&hl=es&pg=PP1#v=onepage&q&f=false

 

as the author said, mantras are not secret and not for sell, something that some famous "gurus" do in the states

i find it good to focus, calm down, just for that it deserves the effort

seems to me it'd probably be a good idea for all modern city-dwellers to have some "time out" each day just to be mindful. I'd like that. I have no idea how much TM differs from that, though, I'm guessing it has more of an agenda. And yeah, $2,000 is ridiculous.

  On 4/8/2012 at 12:22 AM, kaini said:

here's a great place to start according to a lot of people: http://www.urbandhar...harma4/mpe.html

Thanks. I am gonna look it up.

  On 4/8/2012 at 12:50 AM, capitan mission said:

I do it. And Im not a religious person.

There are different meditation methods, is something like picking a DAW

I recommend you mantra meditation, you can read a good book like this:

http://books.google....epage&q&f=false

 

as the author said, mantras are not secret and not for sell, something that some famous "gurus" do in the states

i find it good to focus, calm down, just for that it deserves the effort

Thanks. I am gonna check it some more but from the first look that seems to be almost exclusively theory only? I mean... All I could see was analyzing about the mind and comparisons to physical stuff like surgeries and how meditation is good etc but not something concrete about how to get there and exercises / directions (apart a sentence length one about the classic example of focusing into an object). I'm not putting your suggestion down by any means and thanks again for the contribution, I am just pointing it out how I hope there is actually something more into it than something totally abstract and theoretical.

And as for the "gurus" and new age they only drive people away as I said.

I also... erm found some video series / dvds but as YO303 says it's hard to tell the useful ones from the bogus / time-waster ones, at least for the beginner.

I've been interested in meditation for a very long time and have practiced it on and off since junior high. I think it is undeniably beneficial but as others have said it is a discipline and requires as much out of you as any other such practice. Almost definitely worth it, I haven't been doing it lately but I've certainly been meaning to start up again. yeah it's good.

  On 4/8/2012 at 1:44 AM, Disappearer said:

Thanks. I am gonna check it some more but from the first look that seems to be almost exclusively theory only? I mean... All I could see was analyzing about the mind and comparisons to physical stuff like surgeries and how meditation is good etc but not something concrete about how to get there and exercises / directions (apart a sentence length one about the classic example of focusing into an object). I'm not putting your suggestion down by any means and thanks again for the contribution, I am just pointing it out how I hope there is actually something more into it than something totally abstract and theoretical.

And as for the "gurus" and new age they only drive people away as I said.

I also... erm found some video series / dvds but as YO303 says it's hard to tell the useful ones from the bogus / time-waster ones, at least for the beginner.

You're welcome. The practice is ridiculous simple, basically you choose a mantra, and it becomes your "theme song" . The mantra is mentally repeated, in sets of 7, 21 or 108, sit in meditation posture (but not uncomfortable), at evening and dawn if possible. Thats the traditional way.

Concentration is the aim, and one of the best "tricks" that Ive learned is that concentration comes as easily as she goes, so, when you lose it, don't let that disturbs you.

I dont read more books about "mysticism" , thats all what I need now, meditation, the real thing.

This technique is called Japa Yoga and TM and other hyped meditation systems are based on it

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japa

I have some experience on the subject so I will ramble for a bit. Its pretty fundamental and basic: Just get into an asymmetrically relaxed position like on your back (like you just got shot by the town Sheriff) and wait for your thoughts to quiet down (just let them run their course) and breath like you got two of them (lungs) and see how long you can exist like that (like a corpse). After your thinking-mind finally runs out of oxygen and shuts up your ego might try and pull some last ditch efforts to prevent you from locking it down, you might start to notice random itches, If you give them a scratch it could put you back several minutes and break your will (and a repeating cycle like that will make you sleepy and probably take a nap) but if you don't scratch it might just bring stubborn irritable thoughts to the surface and break the spell, the only real solution is to just keep at it every day and eventually you will "sneak one by the man" and after a short while of being in a state of non movement and true non thought your bodies engine will be like "wtf am I asleep?" and it will spurt out a cascade of chemicals normally reserved for sleeping/unconscious people but this time you get a front row seat and its actually kind of scary at first (its a lot like you turn into an anechoic chamber or something) and the typical result is that once it works it quickly undoes itself, the thinking-mind doesn't sit still while strange things are happening and when the thinking-mind starts flailing like a confused Barney Fife then the ride screeches to a stop and your and your back to the world of tampon commercials and limp bizkit.

1. Yeah, if you stick with it, it'll help. I had many of the same reservations as you, and it turned out they were just my brain being terrified of meditating and thus losing control. Take that, brain!

2. Try a bunch of stuff and see what works for you. I took some Buddhist classes ($12, for comparison) that were a big help. Focusing on your breath is a common denominator. I recommend: Feel your body as closely as you can, experience fully what each part of you feels in the moment. Breathe through parts of your body until you feel them lightly tingle.

It's the hardest thing I've ever learned to do, and the benefits for me are enormous. I can't go back to living without that consciousness. Good luck, and remember to let go!

there is so much we do not understand, which humanity in its race for purely intellectual answers, will surely fail to find. we must continue to search but only using something greater then ourselves

Zazen is the art of learning to love sitting, doing nothing. Touching that stillness, much of lifes problems become a distant joke.

  On 4/8/2012 at 6:33 AM, A/D said:

1. Yeah, if you stick with it, it'll help. I had many of the same reservations as you, and it turned out they were just my brain being terrified of meditating and thus losing control. Take that, brain!

 

2. Try a bunch of stuff and see what works for you. I took some Buddhist classes ($12, for comparison) that were a big help. Focusing on your breath is a common denominator. I recommend: Feel your body as closely as you can, experience fully what each part of you feels in the moment. Breathe through parts of your body until you feel them lightly tingle.

 

It's the hardest thing I've ever learned to do, and the benefits for me are enormous. I can't go back to living without that consciousness. Good luck, and remember to let go!

Thanks for the reply. Yeah as I've said, I really wanna try it out and I believe It can actually help. The only problem is (and I am sure you'll understand if you recall how it used to be when you first started) that many things that may make sense and come natural at some point such as "Feel your body", "Focusing on your breath" and others in this thread come across as pretty abstract and generic for someone who's only starting, you know? I think they can only make sense and actually BEING PRACTICED (which is the point) in the context of some video course or a nice book with instructions and/or maybe body position diagrams etc. which would accompany the whole theoretical part and that's the main reason I started this thread. I just can't start practicing without a concrete methodology sticking into a generic "sit in the lotus position in your bed and clean your head and feel your body energy" etc (even if a large part of the whole process is actually this).

I've been thinking about joining the local zen group to practice some meditation. I've tried zazen at home on my own but some kind of outside help would be beneficial I think.

I've also practiced tai chi chuan on and off for few years. It's a sort of meditation practice because the point is to clear your mind and concentrate on the movement and the breathing.

sometimes i get so high i'm like a meditating guru in my brain and shit.

I am resurrecting this thread because meditation is awesome. I had kind of a breakthrough last weekend. This was partially because of Chimera Slot Mom's reminders that meditation is great, so thanks dude!

The breakthrough was that I was erring on the side of control in meditation, and forgetting that it's about a kind of peaceful surrender. The brain can do whatever it wants as long as you let it be & don't get pulled by it. It's a very subtle thing until you feel it. I don't think I would be able to feel the difference without hundreds of times of trying to meditate & becoming more anxious & less at peace.

I've been doing it for a while now. Definitely less stressed than I used to be. I got into because I accidentally meditated without realising it for a fortnight when I was ill and in a lot of pain, and something amazing happened. I've trying to get back to that state for a while now but I think I'd need to go on a retreat to be able to dedicate a big chunk of time to it.

  On 4/8/2012 at 6:02 AM, RadarJammer said:

I have some experience on the subject so I will ramble for a bit. Its pretty fundamental and basic: Just get into an asymmetrically relaxed position like on your back (like you just got shot by the town Sheriff) and wait for your thoughts to quiet down (just let them run their course) and breath like you got two of them (lungs) and see how long you can exist like that (like a corpse). After your thinking-mind finally runs out of oxygen and shuts up your ego might try and pull some last ditch efforts to prevent you from locking it down, you might start to notice random itches, If you give them a scratch it could put you back several minutes and break your will (and a repeating cycle like that will make you sleepy and probably take a nap) but if you don't scratch it might just bring stubborn irritable thoughts to the surface and break the spell, the only real solution is to just keep at it every day and eventually you will "sneak one by the man" and after a short while of being in a state of non movement and true non thought your bodies engine will be like "wtf am I asleep?" and it will spurt out a cascade of chemicals normally reserved for sleeping/unconscious people but this time you get a front row seat and its actually kind of scary at first (its a lot like you turn into an anechoic chamber or something) and the typical result is that once it works it quickly undoes itself, the thinking-mind doesn't sit still while strange things are happening and when the thinking-mind starts flailing like a confused Barney Fife then the ride screeches to a stop and your and your back to the world of tampon commercials and limp bizkit.

This is the best description/advice i've seen in a long time

haha yeah that shit is badass mr. jammer. I am still scratching the surface of deep meditation like that.

It has worked for me, feeling every part of you starting with your toes, I would keep it simple to start with-less expectations equal less pressure to get results and buy a book or dvd at the most, no courses.

I wish I had used meditation to help me through some recent events but the thought never occured to me at the time...