the yamaha FS1R thread

want to start a thread about this one since a long time, super powerful synth but also pretty alien and complicated to program 

any online ressources about the synth ? audio demo ? there's not much on youtube but this one is nice

if you got any tips share them please.

snd - atavism.

That’s all i know about the synth

It was a rare synth even on release. And you wanted to start a thread on this synth for a long time, and this is the result?

3/10

Is it this rare ? Units are going for high prices but that was not the case 10 years ago right ? Just wanted to know more about this synth.

They're pretty rare here in Australia, I only really see one come up for sale locally every couple of years. Then again, a lot of things here are rare lol 

i used to think these were insanely expensive and unattainable.. but looking at prices now (compared to.. digitone, peak, some of the other gear i've purchased).. it's really not as bad as i was originally thinking.. 

  On 5/27/2019 at 6:22 AM, modey said:

They're pretty rare here in Australia, I only really see one come up for sale locally every couple of years. Then again, a lot of things here are rare lol 

and expensive from what I’ve heard !

just sell a few analords and you'll afford it in no time :^)

Remember that Sean from Ae was talking about it in the SOS 2003 itw. Do we know if they use one on confield  or draft ?

There's one for sale for $1,8k here, 4h to go https://auctions.yahoo.co.jp/search/search?auccat=&tab_ex=commerce&ei=utf-8&aq=-1&oq=&sc_i=&fr=auc_top&p=yamaha+fs1r&x=0&y=0&fixed=0

I lasted 30s on the video though because I am not a fan of this sound at all.

I'd really like to try to make some vocal type sounds with it since it can do formants, but I really can't justify the cost of the thing.

From what I hear on atavism you can get that Gabor lazar style sound, I heard that you can use the unvoiced operators for additive synthesis, guess that’s the way to get this type of sound ?

Don’t know about that.

all I know about this is that gabor lazar uses maxmsp, same as mark fell and that both of them used hw and vsti synths in the past like fs1r, dx7, fm8, razor... (info from interviews)

edit: you prob know this but they’ve made an album together and at that time they probably exchanged and shared their mo and max patches with each other 

Yes , great album by the way !

Brand new Max for live editor : http://ilovmachines.com/product-fs1r.html?fbclid=IwAR1yfs5u4EO4HNrKdL-9Kc59Xv2WWSE4n_474zZpE23OhcuGKUWsdornaq8

No disrespect, but what is the point of a complex, not-so-portable, not-so-immediate hardware FM synth in 2019? I lusted after one of these a good 15-20 years ago, but in this day and age of Volca FM in the one drawer, Digitone in the other, and modular environments like Max, SuperCollider, VCV Rack in your lap, what's the point?

I'm sure it sounds good, I'm sure you can do impressive things with it after getting all the patch editors and manuals set up and dropping $1.8k (!) for a rackmount unit from one of the darkest moments in Yamaha's checkered UI history. But you can also patch a dozen objects together in the (free?) software of your choice and get just as much weirdness and quality, and it will be much easier to control individual patch components.

^ or NI FM8?

Sure! Or Operator, or Reface DX, or preenFM, or SKULPT, or...

from what I understand, it's just the most advanced hardware FM synth ever. In the software realm, FM8 is a strong contender but no formants and unvoiced operators. only problem is the UI, but with those editors, programming it seems much easier. Regarding the price, not everyone paid 1800$ to get one, some people got it for like 300$ ? 

  On 6/8/2019 at 4:12 PM, d-a-m-o said:

from what I understand, it's just the most advanced hardware FM synth ever. In the software realm, FM8 is a strong contender but no formants and unvoiced operators. only problem is the UI, but with those editors, programming it seems much easier. Regarding the price, not everyone paid 1800$ to get one, some people got it for like 300$ ? 

Formants are just fixed-frequency filters, right? I'm pretty sure at least 2 or 3 of the aforementioned alternatives (certainly Max) can achieve these.  $300 is a lot closer to reasonable. The editors might make it tolerable, although the ones I've seen still look pretty painful.

I guess when I hear "advanced" when it comes to synths, I just think of thousands of options and a giant bank of controls and menus to get lost in, and not in a good way. It might be a matter of preference, but I find a more modular (not necessarily hardware) approach a lot more usable. Pick best-of-breed or purpose-appropriate components, integrate them meaningfully, abstract into meta-component(s) if needed, repeat until you have a nice platter of sweet spots.

Yeah tbh that's why I haven't actually been tempted enough to actually pick one up. Sometimes having that much freedom/that many settings just stifles me, it's weird.

But in terms of what it can do that others can't.. I think it's still a lot more advanced than what you mentioned—doesn't it also have a wavetable engine that can be used as FM operators? I'm sure I saw/read/heard that somewhere..

As for max, well not everyone has the time/desire/knowledge to build their own patch emulating an FS1R sounds like an interesting project though.

  On 6/9/2019 at 11:01 AM, modey said:

Yeah tbh that's why I haven't actually been tempted enough to actually pick one up. Sometimes having that much freedom/that many settings just stifles me, it's weird.

But in terms of what it can do that others can't.. I think it's still a lot more advanced than what you mentioned—doesn't it also have a wavetable engine that can be used as FM operators? I'm sure I saw/read/heard that somewhere..

As for max, well not everyone has the time/desire/knowledge to build their own patch emulating an FS1R sounds like an interesting project though.

Expand  

That may be true about the wavetable; also I remember one of the editors has a formant "sampler" that turns samples into formant sequences.

Emulating the entire FS1R voice architecture in Max would probably be a fool's errand. On the other hand, implementing a thin slice of it - one or two of its interesting capabilities - seems at least as easy as the real thing. For example, if I wanted to make a patch where I have a carrier and two percussive modulators each playing a rhythm, I could build that patch fairly easily with hand-drawn looping envelopes in FM8 (and, I assume, the FS1R). But to later edit the rhythms, I have to either open the envelope editor, or MIDI map vertices, both of which sound inflexible and unwieldy. However, in a modular environment, I could just grab 3 operator (osc/env) modules, plug the output of two into the modulation input of the third, then sequence (rhythm AND pitch, dynamics, decay, etc.) the three independently with whatever I want. I can even play them with drum pads for loose, human timing. For wavetables, I can just use a wavetable oscillator. For formants, well, plug a formant filter in. Easier, right?

Emulation aside, the FS1R doesn't have a majestic control surface like a CS80, but it does have an order or two of magnitude more parameters, so it's either excruciating front panel keyhole surgery or editing on an external computer. The latter is a lot less different from just using a software alternative and makes the rackmount unit seem like just a large, expensive dongle.

the new Yamaha MODX and Montage series of synths have 8 operators and all the algorithms from the FS1R. You are missing the formant stuff but there are other features the FS1R lacks that really make up for it. Definitely check those out. Richard Devine even made presets.  Decently priced and actually easy to edit with the knobs and touch screen.

  On 7/28/2019 at 2:09 PM, joeyblush said:

the new Yamaha MODX and Montage series of synths have 8 operators and all the algorithms from the FS1R. You are missing the formant stuff but there are other features the FS1R lacks that really make up for it. Definitely check those out. Richard Devine even made presets.  Decently priced and actually easy to edit with the knobs and touch screen.

i believe devine was able to make presets cos he had access to the editor that users don't normally get access to

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vg796WRZzE&feature=youtu.be&t=1210

  On 7/28/2019 at 2:20 PM, bitchroast said:

i believe devine was able to make presets cos he had access to the editor that users don't normally get access to

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vg796WRZzE&feature=youtu.be&t=1210

he made them from the front panel, i remember him telling me, but I could be wrong

anyway here is something i did for Yamaha with some modX action. I think it's a worthy synth, the beat repeat stuff can get crazy and granular-like timbres on top of your FM, and it is definitely easy to edit from the front panel