Compression, why bother?

ofcourse theres a compression method for every sound, every situation. indeed, tape might be the best in some cases. but in other cases a nice multiband compressor, a highend Urei or even an Alesis 3630 sound much more appropriate.

i mean, who would try to use tape compressing when making a pumping kick-bass combo, where the kick 'cuts' into the bass for example? no one, you'd use sidechaining.

or when flattening out a beat, yeah you can do that (somewhat) with tape, but you'll get much better results when doing it with a nice multiband compressor and tweaking it just right so its flattened adn evened out JUST enough.

or when you want to have a sound cut through the mix, I wouldnt use tape for that, id rather use a high-ratio Urei, SSL or Neve compressor.. or a multiband to make it cut through even more clearly... etc, etc,etc, theres a tool for every situation and tape isnt an instant 'fix-it-all' tool when it comes to compression..

  iep said:

ofcourse theres a compression method for every sound, every situation. indeed, tape might be the best in some cases. but in other cases a nice multiband compressor, a highend Urei or even an Alesis 3630 sound much more appropriate.

i mean, who would try to use tape compressing when making a pumping kick-bass combo, where the kick 'cuts' into the bass for example? no one, you'd use sidechaining.

or when flattening out a beat, yeah you can do that (somewhat) with tape, but you'll get much better results when doing it with a nice multiband compressor and tweaking it just right so its flattened adn evened out JUST enough.

or when you want to have a sound cut through the mix, I wouldnt use tape for that, id rather use a high-ratio Urei, SSL or Neve compressor.. or a multiband to make it cut through even more clearly... etc, etc,etc, theres a tool for every situation and tape isnt an instant 'fix-it-all' tool when it comes to compression..

wurd.

  iep said:

ofcourse theres a compression method for every sound, every situation. indeed, tape might be the best in some cases. but in other cases a nice multiband compressor, a highend Urei or even an Alesis 3630 sound much more appropriate.

i mean, who would try to use tape compressing when making a pumping kick-bass combo, where the kick 'cuts' into the bass for example? no one, you'd use sidechaining.

or when flattening out a beat, yeah you can do that (somewhat) with tape, but you'll get much better results when doing it with a nice multiband compressor and tweaking it just right so its flattened adn evened out JUST enough.

or when you want to have a sound cut through the mix, I wouldnt use tape for that, id rather use a high-ratio Urei, SSL or Neve compressor.. or a multiband to make it cut through even more clearly... etc, etc,etc, theres a tool for every situation and tape isnt an instant 'fix-it-all' tool when it comes to compression..

^^^ yes yes yes

  Analogue Wings said:

  Kcinsu said:

a limiter is a compressor, really

 

Really, but not really. They're usually implemented as compressors with extreme ratios, but the concept is much simpler/less intrusive.

Just like a compressor can be used as a distortion, even though it's not really a distortion.

  $$$Celatid said:

  Analogue Wings said:

  Kcinsu said:

a limiter is a compressor, really

 

Really, but not really. They're usually implemented as compressors with extreme ratios, but the concept is much simpler/less intrusive.

Just like a compressor can be used as a distortion, even though it's not really a distortion.

compressor as distortion? yeah you can clip you signal to hell and back. but it wont sound nice, unless your using something like a empirical labs Distressor or a Culture Vulture.. i wouldnt do that sort of thing with your average vst plugin..

i'd rather use PredatOhm (by the Ohmboyz) or a nice guitar amp modeller (Warp or Amplitude) for distortion...

btw, those new Waves plugins (the SSL-modelled ones) are bound to be goood, check this out: http://www.waves.com/content.asp?id=2055

I'm a fan of crap distortion, I like the sound better. My personal favorite distortion is Fruity Fast Dist, that comes with FL. I'm not a fan of trying to simulate analog with digital. If I want analog, I would go buy some analog synths and stuff, and just not use my pc, but I want to sound digital, because digital is the future, analog is the past, and electronic music is about the year 2053 where we're trippin' out to drugs that you attach to your brain with wires while riding down the gravity well in your starship and listening to music on your sony interceptorman. So basically, if you try to sound analog on a computer:

1) You're a poser because it's not analog

2) You're just rehashing old stuff anyway

3) wtf

4) You suck at life

note: don't take this post seriously as indicated by the following emoticon:

:tongue2:

digital,analog, i dont give a shit!

its all about the sound. and distortions shouldnt sound thin, flat and cold. and, coincidentially, alot of digital distortions sound thin flat and cold. AND A THIN FLAT AND COLD SOUND IS NOT THE SOUND OF 2053. NOR THE SOUND OF RIDING GRAVITY WELLS ON YOUR INTERCEPT0R WIRED INTO A CELATIT.

btw your avatar makes me HUNGER FOR TIBERIUM

  Analogue Wings said:

I don't use compressors. I use technology that compresses naturally (why tweak a million plugin params if you like the way tape saturation sounds?) and then I use a LIMITER (Waves or Soundforge Wavehammer - one day I will be able to afford a nice hardware one) on my final mixes to drag down peaks I didnt intend to have there. That's it.

Waves Limiters are compressors and limiters combined. The L2 can compress the shit out of a mix if you want it to. It doesnt have a ratio control but if you at the waveform in cooledit youll see the lower amplitude peaks have been raised.

  iep said:

btw your avatar makes me HUNGER FOR TIBERIUM

Well I don't have any but you could have some beer.

The only thing that was really to be taken seriously in that post was, I like the sound of cold tinny shit digital distortions.

damn, if i ever saw such a PERFECT PATCH OF TIBERIUM growing, along the road or some shit, i'd harvest it like IT's NOBODYS BUSINESS, fuck beer, THE SPICE MUST FLOW!!

  iep said:

damn, if i ever saw such a PERFECT PATCH OF TIBERIUM growing, along the road or some shit, i'd harvest it like IT's NOBODYS BUSINESS, fuck beer, THE SPICE MUST FLOW!!

 

Too bad the tiberium is meant to terraform our planet by aliens and by harvesting it you are accelerating the terraforming, and we'll die.

IT"S ALL YOUR FAULTS

because it makes everything sound professional

Distortion is compression. Compression is distortion.

  Bubba69 said:

Distortion is compression. Compression is distortion.

almost..

compression evens out the peaks and the troughs..

distortion just clips the fuck out of the peaks.

they are, essentially the same thing though... just your average compressor is a bit more sophisticated than your average distortion unit.

  $$$Celatid said:

I'm a fan of crap distortion, I like the sound better. My personal favorite distortion is Fruity Fast Dist, that comes with FL. I'm not a fan of trying to simulate analog with digital. If I want analog, I would go buy some analog synths and stuff, and just not use my pc, but I want to sound digital, because digital is the future, analog is the past, and electronic music is about the year 2053 where we're trippin' out to drugs that you attach to your brain with wires while riding down the gravity well in your starship and listening to music on your sony interceptorman. So basically, if you try to sound analog on a computer:

 

1) You're a poser because it's not analog

2) You're just rehashing old stuff anyway

3) wtf

4) You suck at life

 

note: don't take this post seriously as indicated by the following emoticon:

:tongue2:

nothing wrong with fruity fast dist. its not nearly as bad as ...BJ OVERDRIVE.

Yeah blood overdrive is like a flow of bloody diarrhea out of a fat ugly old man's asshole.

what does it mean to brickwall something

  Analogue Wings said:

  luke said:

yes, A-Wings brings up a great point. tape does a beautiful job of natural compression.

 

yet another simple tool that can be used in a variety of ways for amazing results

 

Engineer 1: Dude why are you spending 3 days obsessively tweaking 24 instances of that $1200 tube compressor modelling plugin on that blues rock song?

 

Engineer 2: To make it sound like those old records I love from the early seventies

 

Engineer 1: Oh, how did THEY get that sound?

 

Engineer 2: They used something called "tape", but that's archaic and obsolete now

Just for everyone's benefit - you won't get tape compression using a cassette deck, or even a cheap 1/4" reel deck. These devices are not designed to handle large signal levels, so instead of tape compression you'll just get distortion from the head and driver electronics, and a little bit from the tape itself, not to mention massive amounts of pumping hiss. Only high-end studio decks are designed to accept hot levels like this, and they have electronics capable of putting a hot signal onto tape.

As for why people use compression, it's simple - because it often sounds good! The general rule is, the more complicated your mix is, i.e the more elements you have in your track, the more you will have to compress those elements to get them to fit into the dynamic range of the master whilst still sounding distinct. That's why your average drum'n'bass track made these days is ultra-compressed, because minimalism seems to be a dirty word to those guys now. Also, the wider the stereo image of the track, the less compression you'll probably have to use. Paul McCartney wasn't wrong when he said that compression was the glue that held the Beatles' records together, especially when they recorded in mono.

In addition, brickwalling your entire mix to remove peaks from one element is really something you should avoid doing.

  Fred McGriff said:

what does it mean to brickwall something

basically, it's a hard compress that brings the troughs right up to the level of the peaks, thus removing most/all of the dynamic range of the track.

a lot of commercial artists do it so that their tracks are 'loud' when played on the radio.

it sounds like mince..

edit:@ xy..

you can use a cassette deck to compress... you'll get a lot of extraneous noise, but it will cut the dynamic range by a ridiculous amount.. same applies to 1/4"...

just record your file at half speed, with the tape running as fast as possible... when you restore your final dump from tape to full speed, the hiss disappears above the range of human hearing a la stan ricker's mastering technique.

plus, a lot of people here seem to want to re-create that 'damaged tape' effect tht boc does so well..

cassette and 1/4" are ideal for this.. not everybody wants super hi fidelity.

for the record, and for whoever originally asked the question... as you can see, there's about a million different views and uses on/for all the different types of compression..

use your ears.

  Fred McGriff said:

what does it mean to brickwall something

"basically, it's a hard compress that brings the troughs right up to the level of the peaks, thus removing most/all of the dynamic range of the track.

a lot of commercial artists do it so that their tracks are 'loud' when played on the radio. it sounds like mince.."

Technically, a brickwall doesn't bring the troughs right up to the level of the peaks. It simply stops the output signal from going above a certain level. So the situation you described is a brickwall with a large amount of additional gain.

"you can use a cassette deck to compress... you'll get a lot of extraneous noise, but it will cut the dynamic range by a ridiculous amount.. same applies to 1/4"..."

Well, yes, but in reality this compression comes more from the inability of the recording head to drive the signal onto the tape, rather than the tape itself. Proper tape compression is something you can do only on decks of a certain calibre i.e Revox, Ampex, Nagra etc. It sounds very different.

"just record your file at half speed, with the tape running as fast as possible... when you restore your final dump from tape to full speed, the hiss disappears above the range of human hearing a la stan ricker's mastering technique."

This trick can work quite well if you have good enough equipment, but bear in mind that you will probably lose a lot of the bottom octave of your mix by doing it, especially if you are using a domestic reel to reel, as they tend not to work too well below 20Hz.

  xy_politics said:

"just record your file at half speed, with the tape running as fast as possible... when you restore your final dump from tape to full speed, the hiss disappears above the range of human hearing a la stan ricker's mastering technique."

 

This trick can work quite well if you have good enough equipment, but bear in mind that you will probably lose a lot of the bottom octave of your mix by doing it, especially if you are using a domestic reel to reel, as they tend not to work too well below 20Hz.

I use a Revox A77 to do a lot of my mastering stuff and the technique mentioned usually boosts my bass way up, among other things.

  xy_politics said:

Just for everyone's benefit - you won't get tape compression using a cassette deck, or even a cheap 1/4" reel deck. These devices are not designed to handle large signal levels, so instead of tape compression you'll just get distortion from the head and driver electronics, and a little bit from the tape itself, not to mention massive amounts of pumping hiss. Only high-end studio decks are designed to accept hot levels like this, and they have electronics capable of putting a hot signal onto tape.

great point, i went to an audio engineering school and you wouldn't believe the amount of people who ran out to buy 1/4" reel to reel tape recorders so they could get "the warm tape distortion" .

  awepittance said:

  xy_politics said:

 

 

Just for everyone's benefit - you won't get tape compression using a cassette deck, or even a cheap 1/4" reel deck. These devices are not designed to handle large signal levels, so instead of tape compression you'll just get distortion from the head and driver electronics, and a little bit from the tape itself, not to mention massive amounts of pumping hiss. Only high-end studio decks are designed to accept hot levels like this, and they have electronics capable of putting a hot signal onto tape.

 

great point, i went to an audio engineering school and you wouldn't believe the amount of people who ran out to buy 1/4" reel to reel tape recorders so they could get "the warm tape distortion" .

Didn't go to an audio engineering school... but I got mine for free! My old high school was just going to throw it away until I saved it :shade:

I don't use it for distortion as much as take some edge off the digital highs and a tiny bit of compression... just an analog circuit to run stuff through, you know?

so how do you run something through tape?

like i have a wav file on my computer, are you saying, record that onto tape, and then what? bring it back to the computer as a wav? dont you lose sound quality that way?

24/96