The trials of building the haven

awesome! that sounds cool and fun... i'd like to do that too!

  Salvatorin said:

  LARRY said:

  Salvatorin said:

its ridiculous actually, how much philosophy stands behind this project, it would take hours to explain it.

 

please do

 

On a very basic level, I am trying to find a place where I can artificially initiate my mind into a state of not-believing in time, forgetting all the linear qualities placed on this "life" I occupy. And in the relaxing of time constraints, I wish to embrace a certain sense of spirituality, an older, more chaotic form, try and build a bridge to the divine alien, try and feel my ancient genes, prepare myself mentally for what ever may be coming in my future. I want to remember what feeling humans had thousands of years ago, try and connect fully with the "old days" as the native around here call it. But the thing is, I want to engineer this mindset by using certain setting cues, such as particular clothing, smells, sounds, etc. so that I don't have to be there at all times and I can switch between society and "the haven" at will.

I smell a cult

you should spend a lot of time there salvy. like all summer. have you ever read any books by gary paulsen (the hatchet)? it's a kid's book but it had a big impact on me when i read it as a youngster.

  Al Hounos said:

you should spend a lot of time there salvy. like all summer. have you ever read any books by gary paulsen (the hatchet)? it's a kid's book but it had a big impact on me when i read it as a youngster.

oh yeah I've read those, I always compared them to "My Side of the Mountain" which I liked better.

Despite the hold up with transporting wood by water, we've already gotten started on the main temple, it is so weird, it is beginning to look like a ramshackle Hindu Temple...

  Quote

But the thing is, I want to engineer this mindset by using certain setting cues, such as particular clothing, smells, sounds, etc. so that I don't have to be there at all times and I can switch between society and "the haven" at will.

this seems kind of odd. it makes me think first of hippies who don't use deoderant. but also it seems more spiritual not to be controlled by cues like these.

I was really stressed out last year and I walked through this forest a lot. one time on the bus I started talking to this old man who turned out to be kind of a fanatical christian, he was talking about how he trimmed a lot of the trees on the paths in that forest and he thought of it as polishing god's creation. I always think that's a weird impulse to try to make nature more spiritual by shaping it.

anyway that's prob. kind of a tangent to what you're planning and it definitely feels important to change the environment to change my mind sometimes.

  spraaaa said:

  Quote

But the thing is, I want to engineer this mindset by using certain setting cues, such as particular clothing, smells, sounds, etc. so that I don't have to be there at all times and I can switch between society and "the haven" at will.

 

this seems kind of odd. it makes me think first of hippies who don't use deoderant. but also it seems more spiritual not to be controlled by cues like these.

 

I was really stressed out last year and I walked through this forest a lot. one time on the bus I started talking to this old man who turned out to be kind of a fanatical christian, he was talking about how he trimmed a lot of the trees on the paths in that forest and he thought of it as polishing god's creation. I always think that's a weird impulse to try to make nature more spiritual by shaping it.

 

anyway that's prob. kind of a tangent to what you're planning and it definitely feels important to change the environment to change my mind sometimes.

well this is somewhat the idea, except really what I mean by using "cues" is that I have come to believe that if you attach a mental stigma to a certain object or place, over time, one can build up the feeling in this object to the point that wearing it or being there triggers the mindset, meaning I don't need to be a dirty shitty hippy, at a point in time, I will be able to reach the "centeredness" that made things so clear that first day, at will.

I think there is a certain embedded feeling to need to shape natural landscapes for our use, its been the way for tens of thousands of years. <---this is the spirituality that I am trying to get at. Breaking free from the essence of "now" and thinking more on a grander scale. In the "compressionist" sense, I do believe life and consciousness exists purposefully, and all systems on (our) universal scale are exponentially becoming more intricate to a point of ultimate complexity, and I believe, somehow, by isolating myself and getting to learn the true feeling of timelessness, I will be able to prepare myself for the growing complexity of our world. (now funny enough this is novelty theory, although I'd thought of it before reading Terrence McKenna).

Its a given (to me) that the world will grow into an alien thing in the next fifty years of my life. The factors that imply this are so immensely vast (watmm has been going over them to some degree)...I'm being disgustingly vague right now, but I think you get the idea. I really don't want to go through the whole process of starting over with primitive kingdoms as things collapse, there has to be a way to keep what technology and knowledge we have and use it to step forward as a species. But unfortunately, with the imminent threat of global warming in the next century, the process of doing so is hard to grasp. But as someone on this forum once said: "civilization has always flourished in the warm ages."

I plan on organizing the huge amount of raw information I have hungrily absorbed over the past 8 months. Right now my thoughts and connections come like monoliths and it is hard to connect them all at once. In the Haven, I will come to understand the reasoning behind my obsession, and emerge each time slightly more complete, uniting my thought and will, so I can finally reach my goals.

I also want to conduct group hyperspace excursions

err that does sound like a cult

nvm Ima go to taco bell

actually thinking back on what I know of biology & agriculture what we think of as natural is already totally shaped by humans killing/selectively breeding other species... hmm... may have to mindfuck myself with that for a bit before aborbing anything else

taco bell

Oh yeah, that is a mindfuck, I mean all grassland is the result of human activity in primordial times. I wonder what the extent of this is in interior Alaska? I would doubt it in the interior, but on the coastal tundra more north, the erosion and general destruction of the land is quite apparent around all the villages. Around the interior (especially this crazy little climatic pocket of the Fairbanks area, with a year-round temperature range of -60º F to 100º F) the forest is split up into two separate niches, with completely different canopy structure. Either you have spruce forest, which is mossy, wet, and dark and buggy, and generally spooky and mystical....or the birch forest, a never ending white mass of tall branchless trees, with shimmering green on the top and brambles on the bottom. The area I'm making this camp is a mixture between the two, which lends for very beautiful understory full of little fields of Equisetum (the wonderful paleozoic remnant that is halfway in between a mushroom and fern):

beautiful

Awesome man. I support this. I wish I had a place where I could go like that.

But seriously faggots... what makes Salvatorian a cunt for trying to enlighten himself? Even if you don't believe in the things he does, he means nothing but good. You can call him (or me for that matter) a hippie all you want but you just need to realize that that makes you the cunt here.

Power to you man. I hope this turns out as you've planned, or works out even better! Keep us posted.

  Salvatorin said:

bla

i've read about native cultures speaking of personal connections with land. it's something i really feel. there are patches of woods and parks around where i grew up, i feel very nostalgic for them, i feel somewhat tied to the land. i think that's what the deal is with walking around and pruning branches in the forest. respect for the land and a desire to take care of it, developing a personal relationship. if i had a lot of money, i could see myself buying a large patch of wild land and just spending hours walking around doing whatever seemed appropriate. never occurred to me to squat...

p.s. you want a serious nautical experience... a camp i was at, i took sailing classes. one day they say we need to learn how to right the sailboat if it gets knocked over. we were to deliberately flip the boat, then right it. i wasn't too nervous about it -- we live in the age of paranoid safetyism and litigation, i figured they wouldn't let me do anything dangerous for risk of being sued. i had a fuckin' life jacket on. so i follow directions and stand where they say, pull my weight along with the other lads and flip the boat. but shit goes crazy -- the sail is coming down over me and i'm caught in the rigging. the sail is pressing down on my head, it's pulling me deeper, but the life vest is pulling me up. i can't get out. somehow i managed to keep my senses and jettisoned the life jacket, swam off ten feet and popped up to the surface fine. they had the decency not to yell at me for breaking the rules via removing my jacket. i swam away with a lot more respect for random crazy shit.

YOU SOUND LIKE A DAMNED HIPPY

DON'T YOU HAVE SOME OF YOUR POOP TO BE EATING?

HATERS BE JEALOUS

>_< UUHHRHRAAARHRHARAARRARAHAHRHAHAAA

D:< UFUFUFUFFFUUUFFUFUFUFUFUFUFUFFUFUFUFUFUFFFUUUUUU

sounds pleasant salvatorin90210

Maybe I do sound like a hippy over the internet, but I don't think I could possibly be considered a hippy by my behavior or actions. Every "hippy" (old guy or neo-hippy) I've ever met has had literally nothing in common with me and just sort of said "yeah maan" at everything I say. Really if anything, I end up seeming like those crazy guys you see walking around like they have a purpose, and you say hi and they start explaining their latest crazy plan. Like whenever I play jazz with my combo at the coffeehouse, people always end up flocking to me to philosophize. So really I think I end up seeming more like a "hep cat" or "beatnik" or whatever because:

I love abstract jazz

I like coffee

I wear leisure suits and such

I have nice hair which is cut quite often

I do not like shitty rock music

I don't like to smoke weed

I don't have shit in my hair

I don't smell like shit

so I'm not a hippy

your ideas and the way you speak is intensely hippy like, if the hippies you met werent interested then they were pretty nooby hippes.

Just a thought: do you own this land you're building on? You might want to check into that... otherwise, your hard work might disappear one day, or if you happen upon the owner(s) or vice versa... you might disappear.

Maybe my ideas are hippy-like, but Hippies were basically just a retarded fashion movement. The ideas that hippies set into motion don't belong to the subculture, it was just one movement that involved similar ideals, sometimes. But my actual behavior is rarely non-confrontal, relaxed, or peaceful. I guess that is my idea of "hippies" because all the hippies I've ever met are eco-green bullshit organic shitheads (so they weren't really hippies). I would actually say I am more of a cynical ass who has delusions of willpower to change my world.

  Joyrex said:

Just a thought: do you own this land you're building on? You might want to check into that... otherwise, your hard work might disappear one day, or if you happen upon the owner(s) or vice versa... you might disappear.

It is state owned wilderness, and although on a state level Alaska gave up squatter's rights in 1983, on a county-to-county level there is little regulation on state land. Now if this happened to be on private land, I would be screwed. When taking into account the massive amount of unoccupied state land in Alaska, there is nearly no regulations other than "don't build large fires."

  Salvatorin said:

  Joyrex said:

Just a thought: do you own this land you're building on? You might want to check into that... otherwise, your hard work might disappear one day, or if you happen upon the owner(s) or vice versa... you might disappear.

 

It is state owned wilderness, and although on a state level Alaska gave up squatter's rights in 1983, on a county-to-county level there is little regulation on state land. Now if this happened to be on private land, I would be screwed. When taking into account the massive amount of unoccupied state land in Alaska, there is nearly no regulations other than "don't build large fires."

Cool, go on wit yo bad self!

i support this and would like to visit one day

HEY EVERYONE PARTY AT SALVO'S HIDEOUT

i once made a gang hut too.