A Universe of Nothing

  On 10/29/2009 at 5:05 AM, Gary C said:

 

Will we bother filing down every little micro-atomic structure and gazing up into every black-hole in search of some mathematical rule forever? Or will we ever call it quits and be happy knowing that we looked hard enough?

I doubt the latter, but I can't imagine we'll stop looking until either: a) we die or b) we meet a life-form of significantly greater intelligence.

I hear what happens at that point is we see our stats for level 1, and then move on to level 2....

  On 10/27/2009 at 3:49 PM, lumpenprol said:

Wow, all it took was a single sentence for Dawkins to remind me what an utter tool he is. I bet he can only achieve sexual gratification by imagining Harry Potter and Jesus fellating each other.

lol

  On 10/29/2009 at 5:05 AM, Gary C said:

Macro/Micro.

 

I have a feeling that even smashing protons in the LHC will only give us a whole shit-load more crazier stuff to fathom on an even more unimaginably small scale. Just as gazing into space will only have it seem bigger and bigger.

Perhaps our universe is as infinitely finicky as it is large. Will we bother filing down every little micro-atomic structure and gazing up into every black-hole in search of some mathematical rule forever? Or will we ever call it quits and be happy knowing that we looked hard enough?

I doubt the latter, but I can't imagine we'll stop looking until either: a) we die or b) we meet a life-form of significantly greater intelligence.

Well Said 'C'.

-----------

The nature of this place is to distract us from trying to know the mystery by

putting beautiful pictures and experience everywhere. We can follow what we see

or we can start to understand that which we can't see and that which is waiting inside us

to be unlocked.

there is a way in which the human body was designed to interact with this natural

world that is void of much pain, sorrow and suffering. when we find this way of living

again either as individuals or as groups then these latent functions inside will unlock.

it's all about switches, triggers, and codes. we are 70% water (thats a clue)

we were designed without shoes (thats a clue) we can run more or less efficiently

like a machine ( this is also a big clue) there are many more. 'search and you shall find'

for... without searching there is no finding.

follow simplicity and the answers will unfold.

we are not just a bunch of monkey around here

Truth +8 (eternal truth)

Run across water barefoot?

Fuuuckkc... something's happen- to meeeeeerrrarrhghhghghg...

  On 10/29/2009 at 5:37 AM, troon said:

  On 10/29/2009 at 5:05 AM, Gary C said:

Macro/Micro.

 

I have a feeling that even smashing protons in the LHC will only give us a whole shit-load more crazier stuff to fathom on an even more unimaginably small scale. Just as gazing into space will only have it seem bigger and bigger.

Perhaps our universe is as infinitely finicky as it is large. Will we bother filing down every little micro-atomic structure and gazing up into every black-hole in search of some mathematical rule forever? Or will we ever call it quits and be happy knowing that we looked hard enough?

I doubt the latter, but I can't imagine we'll stop looking until either: a) we die or b) we meet a life-form of significantly greater intelligence.

 

 

Well Said 'C'.

 

The nature of this place is to distract us from trying to know the mystery by

putting beautiful pictures and experience everywhere. We can follow what we see

or we can start to understand that which we can't see and that which is waiting inside us

to be unlocked.

 

there is a way in which the human body was designed to interact with this natural

world that is void of much pain, sorrow and suffering. when we find this way of living

again either as individuals or as groups then these latent functions inside will unlock.

 

it's all about switches, triggers, and codes. we are 70% water (thats a clue)

we were designed without shoes (thats a clue) we can run more or less efficiently

like a machine ( this is also a big clue) there are many more. 'search and you shall find'

for... without searching there is no finding.

 

follow simplicity and the answers will unfold.

 

we are not just a bunch of monkey around here

 

Truth +8 (eternal truth)

Probably shouldn't be taking this seriously... but there is no design... its all random. We exist today because randomly things happened to allow it... The only fool is the one that thinks that because we exists and that because the world around us exists over our rule, that it means our existence has more significance then a bee or an ant.

naw man, you gotta like, think with your heart man. spirits and shit.

beaw,,..

I like the thought that in an infinite universe every event has happened an infinite number of times, or will eventually happen, just through quantum fluxuation. Its like a quantum monkey on a typewriter example.

  On 10/29/2009 at 5:45 AM, karmakramer said:

  On 10/29/2009 at 5:37 AM, troon said:

  On 10/29/2009 at 5:05 AM, Gary C said:

Macro/Micro.

 

I have a feeling that even smashing protons in the LHC will only give us a whole shit-load more crazier stuff to fathom on an even more unimaginably small scale. Just as gazing into space will only have it seem bigger and bigger.

Perhaps our universe is as infinitely finicky as it is large. Will we bother filing down every little micro-atomic structure and gazing up into every black-hole in search of some mathematical rule forever? Or will we ever call it quits and be happy knowing that we looked hard enough?

I doubt the latter, but I can't imagine we'll stop looking until either: a) we die or b) we meet a life-form of significantly greater intelligence.

 

 

Well Said 'C'.

 

The nature of this place is to distract us from trying to know the mystery by

putting beautiful pictures and experience everywhere. We can follow what we see

or we can start to understand that which we can't see and that which is waiting inside us

to be unlocked.

 

there is a way in which the human body was designed to interact with this natural

world that is void of much pain, sorrow and suffering. when we find this way of living

again either as individuals or as groups then these latent functions inside will unlock.

 

it's all about switches, triggers, and codes. we are 70% water (thats a clue)

we were designed without shoes (thats a clue) we can run more or less efficiently

like a machine ( this is also a big clue) there are many more. 'search and you shall find'

for... without searching there is no finding.

 

follow simplicity and the answers will unfold.

 

we are not just a bunch of monkey around here

 

Truth +8 (eternal truth)

 

Probably shouldn't be taking this seriously... but there is no design... its all random. We exist today because randomly things happened to allow it... The only fool is the one that thinks that because we exists and that because the world around us exists over our rule, that it means our existence has more significance then a bee or an ant.

LOL at designed without shoes and run efficiently.

If there is any proof that we were not "intelligently designed" it is in our actual make-up.

Waste system? That's not very intelligent. Joints weak as fuck, easy to ruin? That's not very intelligent.

We are nothing more than a collection of atoms organized in a certain structure, that is bound by physical laws. Stuff like the first law of thermodynamics, law of gravity, Newton's three laws of motion etc.

Significance to whom? My existence has much more significance to me than a bee's does to a bee.

scientists are way off the mark here because the universe only appears to us as it does because the collapse of the wave function takes place in the human brain.

RE: Science vs. Religion (sorry for this post approaching Sini proportions)

Are these our only two choices?

Are they mutually exclusive?

How does Spirituality differ from Religion?

I've been a believer in Science since I was a child, but as I became older and dug deeper into it I began to realize that the scientists were fudging things all over the place, bending the math (which I previously believed was rigid), and sometimes even pulling stuff out of thin air. If they felt that they had the correct answer but weren't able to find the math prove it, just add in a cosmological constant here or an imaginary number there. In the OP's video Lawrence Krauss alludes to this behavior regarding string theory.

Still, it's the best that we can do - the only way to go on. Otherwise Einstein might have sat around for 50 years doing nothing. Fortunately technology advances far enough to be able able to prove or disprove the theories by using observation and we either accept or reject the theories and move on. Sometimes the fudged numbers work, sometimes they don't.

In the OP's video (watched it all- knew some of the stuff, learned some new stuff) the most interesting part for me was when Krauss described the universe 100 billion years into the future. He explained (as mentioned elsewhere in this thread) that galaxies would become so far apart, and be moving faster than the speed of light that observers in any galaxy would be unable to perceive any other galaxy.

Therefore life arising on a planet at this point in time would perceive the universe as static, with only their single galaxy in it. They would have absolutely no perception of a big bang or the existence of the billions of other galaxies in the universe. Now for the interesting part - based on both calculations and observations they would be able to prove that the universe was static, had always existed, and would always exist in this way. By every shred of logic they would appear to be right, but in actuality they would be dead wrong.

So - isn't it possible that we may be in exactly the same situation in our time period of the universe? Yes, we're finding evidence that the universe is expanding, and then extrapolating that data back to a big bang scenario, etc. We may eventually explain things like gravity, what caused the big bang and so on. However we too may be dead wrong, due to being unaware of earlier events in the universe that are totally outside of our perception. In fact this may be why the big bang and singularity principles are inexplicable, and the laws of physics break down at those points. Still, it's the best that we can do - the only way to go on.

In my case, my head agrees with science - but my heart feels there is something more. My opinion is that Science and Spirituality (not to be confused with Religion) are both partially right, and the true nature of the universe may be some sort of combination of the two. After all the word supernatural means above or beyond nature. When science explains something that was previously categorized as supernatural it simply becomes natural.

Makes me think of Ken Wilber (besides i'd like to thank the guy who recommended Rational Mysticism by John Horgan, it was a good read)

  wikipedia said:

Wilber on science

 

Wilber describes the current state of the "hard" sciences as limited to "narrow science", which only allows evidence from the lowest realm of consciousness, the sensorimotor (the five senses and their extensions). What he calls "broad science" would include evidence from logic, mathematics, and from the symbolic, hermeneutical, and other realms of consciousness. Ultimately and ideally, broad science would include the testimony of meditators and spiritual practitioners. Wilber's own conception of science includes both narrow science and broad science, e.g., using electroencephalogram machines and other technologies to test the experiences of meditators and other spiritual practitioners, creating what Wilber calls "integral science".[citation needed]

 

According to Wilber's theory, narrow science trumps narrow religion, but broad science trumps narrow science. That is, the natural sciences provide a more inclusive, accurate account of reality than any of the particular exoteric religious traditions. But an integral approach that evaluates both religious claims and scientific claims based on intersubjectivity is preferable to narrow science.[citation needed]

Jesus fucking Anarchist.

  On 10/29/2009 at 2:47 AM, Gary C said:

Hopefully with advancements in technology and with more people looking out for these things, we may be witness to such an event in our lifetime. The Kamiokande Facility in Japan for example is a vault that detects exploding stars. Just look at it. Really. WTF

 

lol wrong. kamiokande is used to detect neutrinos

  On 10/29/2009 at 5:15 PM, Super lurker ultra V12 said:

  On 10/29/2009 at 2:47 AM, Gary C said:

The Kamiokande Facility in Japan for example is a vault that detects exploding stars. Just look at it. Really. WTF

 

lol wrong. kamiokande is used to detect neutrinos

Including neutrinos from supernovae.

I don't believe it

Guess I should feel privileged to live in this time period of our Universe

right, everyone in this thread walk on please, there's nothing to see here.