Purchasing ProTools

Pro Tools kinda has the same problem as Fruity Loops in terms of naming themselves, but with polar opposite starting points for sarcastic criticism.

  On 5/6/2010 at 8:23 AM, acid1 said:

Pro Tools kinda has the same problem as Fruity Loops in terms of naming themselves, but with polar opposite starting points for sarcastic criticism.

Haha, yeah, the only other stuff that has "pro" on it in is normally amongst the cheapest gear you can buy :)

the only reason protools became the industry standard was because it was the only application that could be used with the DSP acceleration cards that digidesign made.

digi (and subsequently avid) rested on this for a long time, apparently assuming that their substandard ADCs, clocks, and general hardware would carry them forever.

as soon as native systems became powerful enough to rival the HD systems (about 3 or 4 years ago), digi should have changed their game. but they didn't.

avid is losing customers, and fast. 192s were COMPLETELY unavailable for a period of several months last year. a buddy of mine at west LA music was buying used 192s to sell to his PTHD customers because avid wasn't producing.

they continue to charge several grand for features like timecode and proper handling of video within PT projects. they're continuing to charge premiums for features that are standard in other applications.

unless your'e willing to splash out for HD or EVERY add-on pack for an LE system, you won't be able to deliver projects in a professional environment - at least not where music or sound for picture is involved.

i have been writing film and tv music professionally in hollywood for a few years (albeit on a small scale), and i work in logic. yes, most music editors use PT (studios rarely determine delivery format, it's up to the music editor 99% of the time).

i deliver a cue with a specified bit depth / rate, and an SMPTE start time. done. if your client is saying that's insufficient, then your client needs to learn their craft better.

pro tools is going away. major studios (those that still remain) are ABSOLUTELY switching to other solutions. logic definitely seems to be the frontrunner, simply because it's so well integrated and stable (relatively speaking.)

if avid finally releases a native version of PT that includes their plugins for a reasonable price, they may hold on. but as long as they try to keep charging $10k for systems less powerful than what you can get for half that much, they're not going to be holding on.

beyond that, it's whatever your'e comfortable in. i started with cakewalk, used reason, switched to a roland VS-2480 for a while, then to PT, then to logic...they've all got benefits. at the end of the day, whatever helps you get the results you're looking for sonically is what you should use.

there is arbitrary PT hate, just as there's arbitrary PC hate, or arbitrary MAC hate. but there are valid reasons to move off of pro tools, and it's happening.

well said

edit: not that i condone this type of thing... but you can't pirate a protools system. All of these other fancy hosts like Nuendo and Logic can be found easily on the internet to check out (if you aren't sure about purchasing yet)

"Arrrrr. We're comin' aboard, eh!"

Ableton FTW.

  On 5/4/2010 at 4:12 AM, Lube Saibot said:

Recording wise... Don't let anybody ever fucking tell you country-ass backwards crap like "ProTools has better summing than that toy Ableton Live". Before sticking a fucking medieval sword in his liver (that you obtain by your own devices, i have no suggestions here) tell him this: "So, one software can add 2 + 2 better?" He might mention dithering as he's losing blood, but as you pull the sword out of his dying husk and spin for the coup the grace, mention in passing: "So, one software can apply one of quite a few dithering algorithms better?" Take his corpse with you, you can later carve his skull into a urinal.

This just grated in my ears, because digital audio summing is way more complex than "2 + 2", which is why a lot of programs do in fact do it differently. I've heard some shocking audio examples of the differences between some programs (Audition is horrid). That being said, if you have a problem with how a certain program sums/dithers, you should just be mixing on analog hardware. Analog is superior, as analog clipping is warm and sometimes desirable while digital clipping is like someone shitting in your ears. Bits and electrical signals are incomparable.

Quality modeling stuff is to the point where it's hard to tell the difference though, so whatevs. Here I am saying this and I do it all ITB. I went to school for recording and decided I didn't care that much about perfectly capturing other people's music. Computers will color your sound. Big deal. Work with it.

Anyway, sine and cosine. Figured I'd add them while I'm off on this tangent.

Of course it's not as simple as that, i was simply trying to illustrate the fact that there is no margin of variance, coloring potential, or artistry to cold hard maths. I do believe in Audition's case it's more in the coding that supports the summing process rather than in the summing math itself; also, using Audition as an example is a fucking cop-out, that program is almost beautiful in the creative ways it manages to fail in every aspect.

I haven't use it for more than a total of 4 minutes before uninstalling it so I can't be held witness to this summing defect you mention, though, it might just be you listening for "bad summing" and thus hearing it.

Kindly refer to this:

wahrk had me going for a second until he said that about Audition, what gave you the idea that it's 'horrid' ? love to be able to hear these same 'shocking examples' you are referring to for my own piece of mind.

  On 5/9/2010 at 6:55 AM, wahrk said:

analog clipping is warm and sometimes desirable while digital clipping is like someone shitting in your ears. Bits and electrical signals are incomparable.

True. A good way of avoiding this if you're insistent on mixing in the box is to always put every setting to below digital 0 even if it's not registering a clip. Even Bob Katz recommends doing this because even though the software will tell you everything is fine it can still be clipping. So take it down at least .3 and you'll be safe in pretty much all instances. If you're vigilant and do this on every plug-in, every channel etc you will be rewarded with much cleaner, more spacious audio without having spent any extra money.