Why I'm proud to be an American

  On 1/8/2011 at 1:27 AM, chassis said:

Britain has some of the worst scumbags. Isnt knife crime and club shooting a massive problem in London.

 

You say that, it was a mass media panic that all these money grabbing cunts from the papers made it to be. Knife crime never made a huge increase in the noughties. Stat wise the eighties was a far worse place to live in London if all you think about is gang on gang killings.

Not saying that it's not something that needs tackling but last year and in 09 the whole fucking media drilled this shit into you. Compare that to now. As little as two years later and there's nothing.

It's always happening. It just got blown out of proportion for a while.

It's the same for gun crime.

  On 1/8/2011 at 1:05 AM, fiznuthian said:

Fred, i'd really like to know what you don't like about anti-americanism.

a)i'm american and despite my own views on my country, i take anti-americanism at least somewhat personally especially if it comes from someone with no firsthand experience. it's like being black, or jewish, or you-name-it minority/ethnicity. you get a pass to tell your ethnic jokes but when someone else starts yelling nigger you are going to get defensive.

b)it's rarely new or worthwhile criticsm. it's shit that has been picked up secondhand and perpetuated forever. LOL U EAT HAMBURGERS AND HOT DOGS LOL. NO CULTURE. RICKI LAKE AND WRESTLING. that's some tired bullshit. when you are flogging a dead horse thinking you're entertaining us with some new and novel ideas, then it's so unimpressive, especially on watmm when it's largely preaching to the choir.

c) most of all, i'm anti-nationalist. and anti-americanism implies nationalism. i think we're all people, some of us smarter than others, some of us with better taste than others, some of us more geographically or economically priveleged than others, etc. there are reasons why people think the way they do. why would some poor redneck from kansas give a shit whether or not they could place france on a map? how is that going to put food on the table? yes education is an issue, and to be clear if you want to talk politics, then have a field day, but when you are taking jabs at culture, or the perceived stupidity of america, then i think you need to look in the mirror because chances are high that you have plenty of ignorance to deal with in your own back yard. ignorance is completely relative. americans are on-the-whole a landlocked people with no exposure to any other country. and why should they be? there are three countries in our quadrant of the globe*. plus, wrestling, reality TV, shit hollywood films, mcdonalds-- all these are successful exports because there are always plenty of people in every crevice of the world ready to lap it up. not just americans.

america has its issues, but there is a massive population of quiet, well-intentioned, rational, hard-working individuals that doesn't make the news, that doesn't color international perception, and is victim to the bad name that the extreme ones that are fucked up and make daily headlines give us all.

*yes i know there are a bunch of tiny ones near the equator but i think my point stands

  On 1/8/2011 at 2:09 AM, Fred McGriff said:

  On 1/8/2011 at 1:05 AM, fiznuthian said:

Fred, i'd really like to know what you don't like about anti-americanism.

 

a)i'm american and despite my own views on my country, i take anti-americanism at least somewhat personally especially if it comes from someone with no firsthand experience. it's like being black, or jewish, or you-name-it minority/ethnicity. you get a pass to tell your ethnic jokes but when someone else starts yelling nigger you are going to get defensive.

 

b)it's rarely new or worthwhile criticsm. it's shit that has been picked up secondhand and perpetuated forever. LOL U EAT HAMBURGERS AND HOT DOGS LOL. NO CULTURE. RICKI LAKE AND WRESTLING. that's some tired bullshit. when you are flogging a dead horse thinking you're entertaining us with some new and novel ideas, then it's so unimpressive, especially on watmm when it's largely preaching to the choir.

 

c) most of all, i'm anti-nationalist. and anti-americanism implies nationalism. i think we're all people, some of us smarter than others, some of us with better taste than others, some of us more geographically or economically priveleged than others, etc. there are reasons why people think the way they do. why would some poor redneck from kansas give a shit whether or not they could place france on a map? how is that going to put food on the table? yes education is an issue, and to be clear if you want to talk politics, then have a field day, but when you are taking jabs at culture, or the perceived stupidity of america, then i think you need to look in the mirror because chances are high that you have plenty of ignorance to deal with in your own back yard. ignorance is completely relative. americans are on-the-whole a landlocked people with no exposure to any other country. and why should they be? there are three countries in our quadrant of the globe*. plus, wrestling, reality TV, shit hollywood films, mcdonalds-- all these are successful exports because there are always plenty of people in every crevice of the world ready to lap it up. not just americans.

 

america has its issues, but there is a massive population of quiet, well-intentioned, rational, hard-working individuals that doesn't make the news, that doesn't color international perception, and is victim to the bad name that the extreme ones that are fucked up and make daily headlines give us all.

 

*yes i know there are a bunch of tiny ones near the equator but i think my point stands

awesome, thanks man. that's a completely understandable position.

for real though, pizza hut cheesy bites pizza was the dealbreaker. i piss on america.

America was pretty great til all these white people showed up.

i haven't travelled enough to comment on America from the outside. I will say that the health care system is a down right sin in this country. The idea that we can cure people and they die cause they don't have money is a fucking sin. Everything is God this God that, but America worships money and selfishness. I hate to say it but that is how I see it

  On 1/8/2011 at 4:22 AM, marf said:

i haven't travelled enough to comment on America from the outside. I will say that the health care system is a down right sin in this country. The idea that we can cure people and they die cause they don't have money is a fucking sin. Everything is God this God that, but America worships money and selfishness. I hate to say it but that is how I see it

I dont think thats fair, you cant blame people for the shit state western democracy is in. People with money will do anything to hold on to it and that includes buying off the government. America isnt just fucking the rest of the world, its fucking its own people as well. Its just a shame that a lot of the people that prop these cunts up believe the shit theyre fed and to disagree is unAmerican/unBritish.

Yeah, now that I think more about it. Its pretty unfair to lump everyone into the one category. But when you say "Im proud to be such-and-such nationality", you are saying you are proud of your country and all the aspects of it. But you I cant hate a whole country, plus most of the Americans on here are cool :sup: .

But the American government lately have been pissing me off with their backhanded ways and controlling. This is mostly in reference to the whole piracy issue and them putting pressure on other countries to conform to their way of thinking. Big fat cat companies fucking over the rest of the world.

  On 1/8/2011 at 4:45 AM, chassis said:

Big fat cat companies fucking over the rest of the world.

This is exactly it, but it has nothing to do with America. State-ism is largely obsolete. Multinational corps are the true enemy. Welcome to the future.

  On 1/7/2011 at 7:38 PM, 24ourange said:

  On 1/7/2011 at 12:43 PM, Squee said:

Now here's something I've been thinking about... how can you say, 'I'm proud to be an American' when you didn't choose to be one yourself?

 

So you cant be proud of something you didnt choose? So people cant be proud of their heritage? Of their culture?

 

 

 

Ive thought a lot about being proud of my situation being an american. It seems like a lot of people consider being an American to be a huge fucking chore, or a disgrace. One look at our politics, our sensationalist news articles, one tires of the constant limelight that america gets. Im sure its not hard to guffaw, to look down your nose and generalize america as being some horse with busted knees writhing in a muddy ditch for dear life.

 

At the same time, having lived in america for more than 2 decades i can safely say that i and most other people from america have had some of the most privileged most luxurious quality of life in history of mankind. It's ridiculous the opportunities that we have access to, how much control we have over our lives despite anything anyone in washington can do.

 

I'm really quite loathe to support nationalism in any form. So i don't like saying that im proud to be an American. There are things this country does and has done that are ridiculously deplorable by any standards. I have no doubt this is the case with all countries. However it seems like very few are genuinely appreciative of what america has provided them over these short few centuries.

 

Maybe it's just me, but i have never found any consistency with the America that is portrayed on the news, on the internet and the america i have experienced on a day-to-day basis.

My thoughts exactly, thanks for making this post so I didn't have to. +1 etc

i'm gonna wikileak yalls anti american comments

how many of you have upper middle class parents? Maybe you like them and not really america. People with lots of opportunity seem to be from upper middle class homes. Just seems that way

  On 1/8/2011 at 7:48 AM, marf said:

how many of you have upper middle class parents? Maybe you like them and not really america. People with lots of opportunity seem to be from upper middle class homes. Just seems that way

confusing sentence is confusing

McDonalds, Wal-Mart, The Gap, Baseball, NFL, Rock and roll, The Internet, Slavery, Starbucks, Disney world, Porno, Valium, Reeboks, Fake Tits, Sushi, Taco Bell, Rodeos, Bed bath and beyond, Liberty, White Slips, The Alamo, Band-aids, Las Vegas, Christmas, Immigrants, Popeye, Democrats, Sportsmanship, Books.

Fuck Yea

  On 1/8/2011 at 7:48 AM, marf said:

how many of you have upper middle class parents? Maybe you like them and not really america. People with lots of opportunity seem to be from upper middle class homes. Just seems that way

my parents worked 40 years in a factory, only as of the past few years has she made her way out to bottle chemicals for $12/hour.

we're middle class, but definitely not upper. my parents were smart though, and heavily budgeted their money for many of those first years

to save and ensure my life goes smoothly. it ran out quick though, and currently we all just kind of get by.

i work as much as i can, but am nowhere near being able to sustain myself safely and independently. in that respect i guess there is a line somewhere that once crossed people lose the ability to make anything of themselves and probably become stuck and suffer. thing is, every person i have met or seen in this condition spend chunks of their income on drugs, some become criminals and can't work, then some are just too preoccupied with their desires and "needs" (debt?) to go get a job and fix their situation. i'm willing to bet only a small percentage of poor and homeless in this country are there for reasons that were outside of their control.

i mean, if i lived in the projects and had the means to get a job.. there's no way i'd spend my money on anything but food, rent, some kind of transportation (even if a 100 dollar bike), and as few bills as i can manage.. and i certainly wouldn't try to create a family, and certainly wouldn't blow my money on television, internet, drugs, or even clothes i don't fucking need until my life is somewhere OTHER than the projects and financially stable. i don't need to look attractive if my priority is to stop being poor. yet a lot of poor families continue to produce more children, pay TV bills, get contract cell-phone plans, new shoes, mcdonalds meals, etc.. only to rob themselves of any progress they could make otherwise. i'd be eating some rice, beans, and pasta like clockwork, not overpriced fast food that leaves me hungry an hour later.

but i digress, this doesn't apply to everyone and for them their story is much different. you know the kind of people i'm talking about here though, the folks scanning frivolous shit onto their food stamp card at supermarkets, often not even food.

The ironic thing about the predictable and cliched anti-Americanism in this thread is that it is born of the kind of uninformed qualitative judgments that are at the root of strong nationalistic feelings. In other words, all of the easy, go-to cracks about McDonalds and NASCAAR etc. stem from the following thought processes:

"I say, those savage Americans are awfully fat and thickheaded. Nothing like we refined and dignified subjects of the Crown."

Your own feelings of superiority are nothing more than nationalism, even if you don't call it that. Also, yes this was the land of the Native Americans, and yes we all but stamped them out completely. But none of that would ever have happened if it weren't for Britain's colonial exploitation of nearly the entire world. Britain's list of sins runs long. So drop a lump of humility into your dainty cups of tea please.

jesus fucking christ.

this thread is like an episode of south park, and mcgriff is stan at the end.

if this is South Park, you are Tweak

  On 1/8/2011 at 4:18 PM, LOL Alzado said:

The ironic thing about the predictable and cliched anti-Americanism in this thread is that it is born of the kind of uninformed qualitative judgments that are at the root of strong nationalistic feelings. In other words, all of the easy, go-to cracks about McDonalds and NASCAAR etc. stem from the following thought processes:

 

 

"I say, those savage Americans are awfully fat and thickheaded. Nothing like we refined and dignified subjects of the Crown."

 

 

 

Your own feelings of superiority are nothing more than nationalism, even if you don't call it that. Also, yes this was the land of the Native Americans, and yes we all but stamped them out completely. But none of that would ever have happened if it weren't for Britain's colonial exploitation of nearly the entire world. Britain's list of sins runs long. So drop a lump of humility into your dainty cups of tea please.

Im sorry, but you cant get all defensive when you put up your country as a topic for discussion and people disagree with you. Americans are just as bad for stereotyping nationalities, if not worse.

And Im not talking about your stupid tourist that comes over here with no knowledge of the culture whatsoever. Heres my example, my point is made at the very last bit of the video.

i expected a sob story from my comment, and there are always the exceptional people that get ahead on there talents and brains. I have a couple friends like that, but after living in two college towns id say the majority of kids that move on to a good life come from stable families, and an area with good schools. They have the money to help them out, maybe pay their rent, pay for tutors, buy them a car, food, unexpected expenses, you know the little things you dont think about but are huge to poor people. Im probably wrong, but im just stating my experience with hundreds of students

  On 1/8/2011 at 2:09 AM, Fred McGriff said:

 

america has its issues, but there is a massive population of quiet, well-intentioned, rational, hard-working individuals that doesn't make the news, that doesn't color international perception, and is victim to the bad name that the extreme ones that are fucked up and make daily headlines give us all.

 

Where are these people in the day to day politics of America? Why have they let the loudmouth morons jump around and represent their country? I have no doubt that there is a large number of rational and intelligent people that at the shit their government is doing. Why have they not stepped up and rocked the boat?

  On 1/8/2011 at 4:38 PM, marf said:

i expected a sob story from my comment, and there are always the exceptional people that get ahead on there talents and brains. I have a couple friends like that, but after living in two college towns id say the majority of kids that move on to a good life come from stable families, and an area with good schools. They have the money to help them out, maybe pay their rent, pay for tutors, buy them a car, food, little unexpected things, you know the little things you dont think about but are huge to poor people. Im probably wrong, but im just stating my experience with hundreds of students

its true. stable family probably has a LOT to do with what people want out of life.

even if the parents have very little money, if they reinforce all of the right things early on it and keep at it it does make a huge difference.

a kid will grow up with a strong will to surpass their parents and succeed.

but then there's the kids born into alcoholic and problematic families that just don't give a fuck about anything,

much less their own children.. its those that are probably destined to fail no matter how many opportunities are presented to them.

they learn that life is shit, goals don't matter, and they'll never be anyone if they try.

i agree about college students. my experience with college students is the exact same.

almost all of them did not start poor, and had very supportive families with plenty of money to fund their education

while the kids do very little to earn any of it.

i don't consider my own situation a sob story though, if anything it leaves me in a great position to both acheive what i want in life and also being able to value what i achieve because i earned it.. i'm not short on opportunity at all. so my parents can't pay for any of my school, but thats okay. i'm healthy, and can get there on my own. what matters most is that i have a great relationship with my family, not that they can pay everything and take care of my every need.

  On 1/8/2011 at 4:50 PM, azatoth said:

  On 1/8/2011 at 2:09 AM, Fred McGriff said:

 

america has its issues, but there is a massive population of quiet, well-intentioned, rational, hard-working individuals that doesn't make the news, that doesn't color international perception, and is victim to the bad name that the extreme ones that are fucked up and make daily headlines give us all.

 

 

Where are these people in the day to day politics of America? Why have they let the loudmouth morons jump around and represent their country? I have no doubt that there is a large number of rational and intelligent population that at the shit their government is doing. Why have they not stepped up and rocked the boat?

well, there is a lot of them.. but they would not be the majority here.

as evidenced by the +50% population that keep voting in dumb shit politicians repeatedly.

  On 1/8/2011 at 4:38 PM, chassis said:

  On 1/8/2011 at 4:18 PM, LOL Alzado said:

The ironic thing about the predictable and cliched anti-Americanism in this thread is that it is born of the kind of uninformed qualitative judgments that are at the root of strong nationalistic feelings. In other words, all of the easy, go-to cracks about McDonalds and NASCAAR etc. stem from the following thought processes:

 

 

"I say, those savage Americans are awfully fat and thickheaded. Nothing like we refined and dignified subjects of the Crown."

 

 

 

Your own feelings of superiority are nothing more than nationalism, even if you don't call it that. Also, yes this was the land of the Native Americans, and yes we all but stamped them out completely. But none of that would ever have happened if it weren't for Britain's colonial exploitation of nearly the entire world. Britain's list of sins runs long. So drop a lump of humility into your dainty cups of tea please.

 

Im sorry, but you cant get all defensive when you put up your country as a topic for discussion and people disagree with you. Americans are just as bad for stereotyping nationalities, if not worse.

And Im not talking about your stupid tourist that comes over here with no knowledge of the culture whatsoever. Heres my example, my point is made at the very last bit of the video.

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Riverdance is clearly the only thing he knows about Ireland He tells him to fuck off not out of surprise but because hes genuinely offended by him being so fucking condescending. How did this man get on television? (in before Bill O Reilly)

 

okay so essentially we've come to one conclusion here:

every country has people who don't see the full picture.

  On 1/8/2011 at 4:57 PM, fiznuthian said:

  On 1/8/2011 at 4:38 PM, chassis said:

  On 1/8/2011 at 4:18 PM, LOL Alzado said:

The ironic thing about the predictable and cliched anti-Americanism in this thread is that it is born of the kind of uninformed qualitative judgments that are at the root of strong nationalistic feelings. In other words, all of the easy, go-to cracks about McDonalds and NASCAAR etc. stem from the following thought processes:

 

 

"I say, those savage Americans are awfully fat and thickheaded. Nothing like we refined and dignified subjects of the Crown."

 

 

 

Your own feelings of superiority are nothing more than nationalism, even if you don't call it that. Also, yes this was the land of the Native Americans, and yes we all but stamped them out completely. But none of that would ever have happened if it weren't for Britain's colonial exploitation of nearly the entire world. Britain's list of sins runs long. So drop a lump of humility into your dainty cups of tea please.

 

Im sorry, but you cant get all defensive when you put up your country as a topic for discussion and people disagree with you. Americans are just as bad for stereotyping nationalities, if not worse.

And Im not talking about your stupid tourist that comes over here with no knowledge of the culture whatsoever. Heres my example, my point is made at the very last bit of the video.

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Riverdance is clearly the only thing he knows about Ireland He tells him to fuck off not out of surprise but because hes genuinely offended by him being so fucking condescending. How did this man get on television? (in before Bill O Reilly)

 

 

okay so essentially we've come to one conclusion here:

 

every country has people who don't see the full picture.

So dont be so offended Alzado.