Occupy Thread

OWS had multiple problems. Its really depressing to watch because had they had a bit more strategy and better timing they could have actually achieved something.

  On 11/15/2011 at 8:04 PM, theSun said:

  On 11/15/2011 at 7:31 PM, theSun said:

what is their justification for a no fly zone?

Why does it matter? You wanna get your chopper and fly over the protesters?

Their justification is probably that they dont want a $300,000 flying vehicle with spinning blades of death to be shot down into a mass crowd of people by some idiot with a gun. I imagine that would escalate things. Maybe.

I think with the crackdown on the occupy camps across the nation, we will soon see the next phase of this... What that is, I have no idea, but I don't think this is the end at all.

Bloomberg said that the press was kept away "to protect members of the press"

Uh... Journalists go to war zones all the time. This is an eviction over a misdemeanor.

I love how Bloomberg and the NYPD (not to mention Oakland Police, etc) keep using the argument that what they're doing is in the health/safety concerns of the occupiers.

If that was actually the case, wouldn't it just be easier to have regular police doing their jobs and patrolling the occupy sites... actually maintaining safety? Also, couldn't they provide Porto-Potties under that same rationale?

It seems like, if they (NYPD, et all) aren't completely full of shit, what they are doing is far mor costly, inefficient, unsafe and unsavory looking than what they should be doing.

Yes, their jobs are hard jobs, but in my first-hand experience with the NYPD, they just wanna be hard and could give two shits about doing what it actually takes to do their jobs and help people.

It still doesn't beat Vancouver trying to evict the protesters because of a drug overdose.

FYI every single 'reason' more like excuse the police and city officials are using to demonize the encampments ie: they are dirty, unsanitary, violent, drug users, etc were leveled at the protesters during the Vietnam war, and pretty much every historically important protest movement of the 20th century.

Same propaganda, different decade.

  On 11/15/2011 at 8:29 PM, acid1 said:

OWS had multiple problems. Its really depressing to watch because had they had a bit more strategy and better timing they could have actually achieved something.

try reading this

  Quote

I have a confession to make. At first, I misunderstood Occupy Wall Street.

The first few times I went down to Zuccotti Park, I came away with mixed feelings. I loved the energy and was amazed by the obvious organic appeal of the movement, the way it was growing on its own. But my initial impression was that it would not be taken very seriously by the Citibanks and Goldman Sachs of the world. You could put 50,000 angry protesters on Wall Street, 100,000 even, and Lloyd Blankfein is probably not going to break a sweat. He knows he's not going to wake up tomorrow and see Cornel West or Richard Trumka running the Federal Reserve. He knows modern finance is a giant mechanical parasite that only an expert surgeon can remove. Yell and scream all you want, but he and his fellow financial Frankensteins are the only ones who know how to turn the machine off.

That's what I was thinking during the first few weeks of the protests. But I'm beginning to see another angle. Occupy Wall Street was always about something much bigger than a movement against big banks and modern finance. It's about providing a forum for people to show how tired they are not just of Wall Street, but everything. This is a visceral, impassioned, deep-seated rejection of the entire direction of our society, a refusal to take even one more step forward into the shallow commercial abyss of phoniness, short-term calculation, withered idealism and intellectual bankruptcy that American mass society has become. If there is such a thing as going on strike from one's own culture, this is it. And by being so broad in scope and so elemental in its motivation, it's flown over the heads of many on both the right and the left.

The right-wing media wasted no time in cannon-blasting the movement with its usual idiotic clichés, casting Occupy Wall Street as a bunch of dirty hippies who should get a job and stop chewing up Mike Bloomberg's police overtime budget with their urban sleepovers. Just like they did a half-century ago, when the debate over the Vietnam War somehow stopped being about why we were brutally murdering millions of innocent Indochinese civilians and instead became a referendum on bralessness and long hair and flower-child rhetoric, the depraved flacks of the right-wing media have breezily blown off a generation of fraud and corruption and market-perverting bailouts, making the whole debate about the protesters themselves – their hygiene, their "envy" of the rich, their "hypocrisy."

Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/how-i-stopped-worrying-and-learned-to-love-the-ows-protests-20111110#ixzz1doXOODSY

[/left]

read that article the other day... excellent!

  On 11/15/2011 at 11:24 PM, Kcinsu said:

read that article the other day... excellent!

+1

its a good article, but nonetheless its no better and perhaps far worse to represent a separation from culture. no wonder people are easily buying into the media misconstruing the movement.

A NY Supreme court judge just overturned the earlier judge's order, and declared the protesters do not have a 1st amendment right to stay over night in the park. no laying down, even without a tent or sleeping bag. time for a massive lay down protest!

30 days to appeal...

no laying! shirts for sale

lying.

  On 11/15/2011 at 11:01 PM, Awepittance said:

FYI every single 'reason' more like excuse the police and city officials are using to demonize the encampments ie: they are dirty, unsanitary, violent, drug users, etc were leveled at the protesters during the Vietnam war, and pretty much every historically important protest movement of the 20th century.

Same propaganda, different decade.

 

  On 11/15/2011 at 8:29 PM, acid1 said:

OWS had multiple problems. Its really depressing to watch because had they had a bit more strategy and better timing they could have actually achieved something.

 

try reading this

  Quote

I have a confession to make. At first, I misunderstood Occupy Wall Street.

The first few times I went down to Zuccotti Park, I came away with mixed feelings. I loved the energy and was amazed by the obvious organic appeal of the movement, the way it was growing on its own. But my initial impression was that it would not be taken very seriously by the Citibanks and Goldman Sachs of the world. You could put 50,000 angry protesters on Wall Street, 100,000 even, and Lloyd Blankfein is probably not going to break a sweat. He knows he's not going to wake up tomorrow and see Cornel West or Richard Trumka running the Federal Reserve. He knows modern finance is a giant mechanical parasite that only an expert surgeon can remove. Yell and scream all you want, but he and his fellow financial Frankensteins are the only ones who know how to turn the machine off.

That's what I was thinking during the first few weeks of the protests. But I'm beginning to see another angle. Occupy Wall Street was always about something much bigger than a movement against big banks and modern finance. It's about providing a forum for people to show how tired they are not just of Wall Street, but everything. This is a visceral, impassioned, deep-seated rejection of the entire direction of our society, a refusal to take even one more step forward into the shallow commercial abyss of phoniness, short-term calculation, withered idealism and intellectual bankruptcy that American mass society has become. If there is such a thing as going on strike from one's own culture, this is it. And by being so broad in scope and so elemental in its motivation, it's flown over the heads of many on both the right and the left.

The right-wing media wasted no time in cannon-blasting the movement with its usual idiotic clichés, casting Occupy Wall Street as a bunch of dirty hippies who should get a job and stop chewing up Mike Bloomberg's police overtime budget with their urban sleepovers. Just like they did a half-century ago, when the debate over the Vietnam War somehow stopped being about why we were brutally murdering millions of innocent Indochinese civilians and instead became a referendum on bralessness and long hair and flower-child rhetoric, the depraved flacks of the right-wing media have breezily blown off a generation of fraud and corruption and market-perverting bailouts, making the whole debate about the protesters themselves – their hygiene, their "envy" of the rich, their "hypocrisy."

Read more: http://www.rollingst...0#ixzz1doXOODSY

[/left]

 

I'm sorry but the part I highlighted is just bullshit. if they're really tired of everything, go buy some cheap land in the middle of Nebraska, start a farm and live off the land like our ancestors did.

Find 1,000 friends, everyone pitch in 3k and buy this:

http://www.landsofnebraska.com/nebraska/index.cfm?detail=&inv_id=477465

Its 2300 acres.

property tax might make that utopia sorta impossible

1,000 friends?

Fine they don't have to be friends. Look at how many goddamned people are at occupy wall street. 1,000 like minded individuals who are supposedly "sick of everything". get the land, get off the grid, make your own culture.

and then have the government burn you alive?

orange!

  On 11/15/2011 at 11:01 PM, Awepittance said:

  On 11/15/2011 at 8:29 PM, acid1 said:

OWS had multiple problems. Its really depressing to watch because had they had a bit more strategy and better timing they could have actually achieved something.

try reading this

I don't disagree with the article, and incase it wasn't apparent I'm very sympathetic to OWS's cause. I still stand by my view that (unfortunately) nothing was achieved and that strategically there were many different ways to change things other then just sitting in a park and pouting.

Given the fact that winter is approaching and a presidential election is next november, they could have benefitted from some better timing.

I think you underestimate the power of discussion. look at every newspaper... it's now a mainstream issue.

  On 11/15/2011 at 8:58 PM, tontonz said:

  On 11/15/2011 at 8:04 PM, theSun said:

  On 11/15/2011 at 7:31 PM, theSun said:

what is their justification for a no fly zone?

Why does it matter? You wanna get your chopper and fly over the protesters?

 

Their justification is probably that they dont want a $300,000 flying vehicle with spinning blades of death to be shot down into a mass crowd of people by some idiot with a gun. I imagine that would escalate things. Maybe.

  On 11/16/2011 at 4:21 AM, Kcinsu said:

and then have the government burn you alive?

 

orange!

Don't fuck kids and you'll probably be alright?

I..............Love

  On 11/16/2011 at 5:20 AM, Kcinsu said:

I think you underestimate the power of discussion. look at every newspaper... it's now a mainstream issue.

I'm hoping it will be like the whole issue with marijuana. People originally tried to legalize it for recreational use, that failed miserably, so then they intelligently repackaged their argument into a medical argument.

OWS was just terrible strategy, once they repackage their argument (probably multiplexing it into multiple arguments) shit will (hopefully) get real.

article is fucking awesome. sure, the bolded part is an exaggeration. not bullshit though.

No it's bullshit.