Higgs Boson discovered

  On 12/13/2011 at 7:45 PM, Bread said:

how about we solve our social problems first

implying that there is a solution. why not chase an answer which we can definitely prove

pants probably stained

  On 12/13/2011 at 8:03 PM, Bread said:

All the time, money/efforts on this project could be put torwards something more productive for society. It's quite a simple train of thought - no Zeitgeist promo needed.

The money used to fund science is infinitesimal in the large scheme of things. In fact more should be spent for top-research since the derivatives that come out of this sort of research and experiments can and will help us on our way to get into your Zeitgeist techno-utopia. While it seems it's just looking for some elusive particles with no immediate practical effect, the research and technology that was developed and used to build the LHC is what can be utilized in other areas and what ultimately pushes technology forward.

It's the Higgs Boson, dammit!!!

  On 12/13/2011 at 8:03 PM, Bread said:

All the time, money/efforts on this project could be put torwards something more productive for society. It's quite a simple train of thought - no Zeitgeist promo needed.

are you literally incapable of reading anything atall without immediately spouting resource based society shit?

The Zeitgeist-movement is like a cult.

maybe instead of buying christmas presents this year i should donate my money to zeitgeist instead and save the world.

  On 12/13/2011 at 8:19 PM, messiaen said:

  On 12/13/2011 at 8:03 PM, Bread said:

All the time, money/efforts on this project could be put torwards something more productive for society. It's quite a simple train of thought - no Zeitgeist promo needed.

are you literally incapable of reading anything atall without immediately spouting resource based society shit?

lol I never said anything about a RBE in that post did I?

  On 12/13/2011 at 8:16 PM, azatoth said:

  On 12/13/2011 at 8:03 PM, Bread said:

All the time, money/efforts on this project could be put torwards something more productive for society. It's quite a simple train of thought - no Zeitgeist promo needed.

 

The money used to fund science is infinitesimal in the large scheme of things. In fact more should be spent for top-research since the derivatives that come out of this sort of research and experiments can and will help us on our way to get into your Zeitgeist techno-utopia. While it seems it's just looking for some elusive particles with no immediate practical effect, the research and technology that was developed and used to build the LHC is what can be utilized in other areas and what ultimately pushes technology forward.

I'm aware though that even our basic needs aren't being fulfilled on a global scale - in my opinion, let's get that fixed first before heading out on any scientific endeavours on this magnitude.

  On 12/13/2011 at 8:24 PM, azatoth said:

The Zeitgeist-movement is like a cult.

Labelling like this creates emotional disdain towards a thoughtful group of people who care about the unsustainable direction we're heading.

Well, there are tons of money that could be taken from elsewhere before going after the non-existent science budgets. Like the multi-billion dollar bailouts given to failed banks and finance institutes.

bread:

In the US (only partially relevant to research at CERN, I know), here's how we spend money.

Note the tiny slivers dedicated to funding scientific research. Note the giant blobs of funding dedicated to HHS (Health and Human Services) and, unfortunately, military spending. Sorry there's no reference for that picture above, I saved it from somewhere a while ago and can't recall the site it came from. Google's got a host of other similar figures though.

Point being, azatoth is right. Cutting funding from scientific research in the hopes that it will help solve "the problems of society" is not a good idea. Not without a damn good plan, anyway, and an actual end goal that is achievable. Even then, there's a lot of other places to cut funding (cough cough, the military) before we go all willy-nilly deleting wonderfully inspiring and profound scientific research projects.

back on topic, fuck yeah CERN, this is exciting stuff :sup:

I don't understand the sudden hate movement on Bread, but I think he's got a valid point.

We currently live in an era where knowing and researching is one of if not the highest moral value. Hence, researchers and science (the former merging themselves with the latter when they use expressions such as "science discovered X") enjoy a very comfortable situation that sets them atop the throne of ethics from which they can look down on the situation. They can do so only because they promise us wonderful things to come. They are trusted, respected, nobelized ; science is a perfectly neutral embodiment of knowledge which cannot be corrupted since any "sold" or "ill-funded" science is not science anymore. In other words, science is not responsible for the vice of the society, it only brings data, discoveries, enlightenments about the world. Thus, citizens should not interfere with the autofecund train of science. And if they still insist in doing so, they'd better have a concise knowing of the concepts involved in scientific discussions.

A few centuries ago, among the three main functions a society needs to fulfill – protection, nourishment and giving meaning to things – (Estates of the realm etc), the latter was supported by clerics. They were standing on the highest moral promontory of their times, promising marvels to people, were beatified and listened to. The speeches they gave dealt with God's universal knowledge, and anyone that dared question its absoluteness, i.e. this absolute merged with their own, was deemed as heretic (from the greek hairesis, "choice"). They presented themselves as being out of the flow of time, pursuing some immortal truth, and denied being tied to the Politic side of their era even though they were financed and sanctioned by their leaders ; this supposed autofecundity being watered by numerous myths, like the Virgin Mary. Finally, their discussions were hardly accessible since their texts were encrypted into difficult and obscure languages - Greek, Latin - and those who remained in the ignorance of these linguistic tools were kept away from the debate. With these arguments in their hands, they presented themselves as the recipient that should receive all the faith of humanity, and were able to reorient humanity's forces into illusory programs - to mention one of them : Crusades.

thank you, data.

  On 12/13/2011 at 4:19 PM, Ricky Downtown said:

so what do we do with the LHC after 2012? just pack up and leave it underground?

I'm sure there are plenty of neutrino experiments they can conduct.

in light of this near-discovery, i recommend we all listen to WATMM's tribute to the Large Hadron Collider, particularly the track "Higgs Loops"

http://www.archive.org/details/fu006

dope track

"Higgins", off Magnum p.i.

:sup:

higgs on bassoon

shopt

Full on lol at Higgs bison.

Bread: would you say our ability to easily link to and share information over the web is pretty important in solving social problems?

back on topic: Higgs hasn't been found, everybody chill the fuck out.

No no...BCM found the Higgs bison in his ass.