Enemy Expatriation Act Could Strip Americans of Citizenship

  On 1/25/2012 at 5:37 AM, baph said:

I think it's a football (the round kind) thing

correct.

not hand egg.

foot ball.

  On 1/25/2012 at 6:13 AM, Awepittance said:

this kind of false equivalency centrism to me is the final nail in his 'progressive president' coffin

wait what people who arent conservatives still think obama is progressive

lol

Could anyone of you Americans see that the people would openly protest and cause real change in your political system? I am not talking about OWS type thing, but something that really could halt the whole country and make the establishment listen (maybe the OWS could at some point grow to such proportions)? The OWS movement has pointed out some of the most glaring things wrong, income inequality, low social mobility and the disproportionally huge influence corporations have on the political process. But it seems the average Joe is not seeing this as a worrying development. Even when his wage has steadily declined while CEO's salaries have increased, and the discrepancy in taxes paid.

Am I reading the wrong news sources and hanging on the wrong forums, but is this not even being discussed in mainstream news? Are they just perpetuating the current narrative of it's either the GOP or the Dems who are diametrically opposed, when in fact both are sitting comfortably on the right, with the GOP sitting on the far right. It seems as the Republicans was infected by the the far-right nutters and moved further to the right, the Dems moved with them.

i think you hit all the salient points there

no, it's not really a topic of discussion in the mainstream media

you have to remember, a significant chunk of americans believe fox news

and an EVEN MORE significant chunk of americans don't pay any attention at all

we are a weird, doomed country.

See any reasons why the people might be so apathetic and don't stop and think for a moment? Is it the education system that is more about getting results than actually learning and thinking for yourself? The constant bombardment of irrelevant shit and an embracing of a "fast food nation" sort of approach to things? But I'd like to think that the average American is smart enough and can draw independent conclusions if given the chance, instead of constantly being spoon-fed things and at some point they will stop and go "wait, a minute, things aren't as they seem".

I've seen reports on polls that a majority of Americans aren't bothered by gay marriage, would like UHC and on a whole support different liberal values. Why is it not showing with the people they elect? Is this just because the political process has been hijacked by big money and the will of the people will only be pandered to when it's re-election. And that's something I also think is weird and does more harm than good, the term lenghts of the representatives. In the House they have 2-year terms, so that just means that they are spending most of the time trying to get re-elected and very little time actually legislating. The Senators have longer terms, but there it's staggered with re-election every two years, once again more time is wasted getting re-elected and coaxing money from different interest groups. Maybe there is a reasonable explanation of this practice, but to me it seems incredibly ineffective. Term-limits could also be a good thing to get rid of those that have been too long there and just turned into a go-to guy for special interests. Same with the president, a 4-year term is a very short time, when one of it is used to get re-elected for a second term. Getting things enacted and done take a long time, especially if there is an obstructionist congress, and all of a sudden the President is on the campaign trail again and rubber stamping questionable legislature. Or keep the news and people occupied with one piece of legislature when meanwhile quietly pass another questionable bill.

  On 1/25/2012 at 10:03 AM, azatoth said:

See any reasons why the people might be so apathetic and don't stop and think for a moment? Is it the education system that is more about getting results than actually learning and thinking for yourself? The constant bombardment of irrelevant shit and an embracing of a "fast food nation" sort of approach to things? But I'd like to think that the average American is smart enough and can draw independent conclusions if given the chance, instead of constantly being spoon-fed things and at some point they will stop and go "wait, a minute, things aren't as they seem".

 

I've seen reports on polls that a majority of Americans aren't bothered by gay marriage, would like UHC and on a whole support different liberal values. Why is it not showing with the people they elect? Is this just because the political process has been hijacked by big money and the will of the people will only be pandered to when it's re-election. And that's something I also think is weird and does more harm than good, the term lenghts of the representatives. In the House they have 2-year terms, so that just means that they are spending most of the time trying to get re-elected and very little time actually legislating. The Senators have longer terms, but there it's staggered with re-election every two years, once again more time is wasted getting re-elected and coaxing money from different interest groups. Maybe there is a reasonable explanation of this practice, but to me it seems incredibly ineffective. Term-limits could also be a good thing to get rid of those that have been too long there and just turned into a go-to guy for special interests. Same with the president, a 4-year term is a very short time, when one of it is used to get re-elected for a second term. Getting things enacted and done take a long time, especially if there is an obstructionist congress, and all of a sudden the President is on the campaign trail again and rubber stamping questionable legislature. Or keep the news and people occupied with one piece of legislature when meanwhile quietly pass another questionable bill.

^ Yep, there are countless broken/dysfunctional elements that are latched on to our political system (special/corporate/union interest influence, entitlement, taxation, health care, military, electoral college, term limits / lack thereof...) - even the average american (and I'm giving him a lot of credit here) can see through the rhetoric and understand that they all need to be fixed. Yet the establishement preys on peoples fears (fear of change, fear of things getting worse, fear of boogeymen...) to maintain a status quo that is beneficial to (surprise!) all the cancers pervading through government. And then it's all filtered through the media conglomerates (all of whom have vested interests at stake) and stupid shit like the "attack on Christmas" bumps any real discussion of the issues off the table. Things are only going to get shittier, and a breaking point will be reached sooner than later (IMHO).

  On 1/25/2012 at 9:17 AM, disparaissant said:

i think you hit all the salient points there

no, it's not really a topic of discussion in the mainstream media

you have to remember, a significant chunk of americans believe fox news

and an EVEN MORE significant chunk of americans don't pay any attention at all

we are a weird, doomed country.

This

Add to the above points the fallacy that every citizen of the US has a chance at making it big if they just buckle down and work harder. This seems to be used to justify lots of people's views on everything from welfare/social programs (you know, all of those lazy people who don't want to get a job and just live off of the gov't) to big business and greed. People don't want to actively criticize or vote against the rich because they think they could get there some day. They want what they have and think they have a chance at it. The single most poisonous idea that infects the U.S. is the "every man for himself" or "I"m just getting for me and my family" mentality.