FBI has 12 MILLION iPhone user's data - Unique Device IDentifiers, Address, Full Name, APNS tokens, phone numbers.. you are being tracked.

  On 9/7/2012 at 11:41 PM, compson said:

Right... if that's as controversial as it gets than I think my point stands. Seems like in at least half of these cases the courts later threw out the evidence because of an abuse of the Patriot Act itself. But keep on living in fear friend.

So you acknowledge that there is abuse involving surveillance methods?

I dunno, I give up I guess. If its not a big deal to anyone there's not much you can do about it.

its just funny to me, I remember being around these boards when the Patriot Act was passed, or a little after that, and people were pretty fucking pissed.

Now 8-10 years later, its as normal as apple pie.

  On 9/7/2012 at 11:46 PM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

  On 9/7/2012 at 11:41 PM, compson said:

Right... if that's as controversial as it gets than I think my point stands. Seems like in at least half of these cases the courts later threw out the evidence because of an abuse of the Patriot Act itself. But keep on living in fear friend.

 

So you acknowledge that there is abuse involving surveillance methods?

 

I dunno, I give up I guess. If its not a big deal to anyone there's not much you can do about it.

Police abuse their powers all the time and not by using the Patriot Act. Does that mean that Police on a structural level is designed to abuse their powers?... or is it individuals acting irresponsibly outside their duties for individual gain? I think its the latter... every institution of power, abuses power but that does not mean the institutions' purpose or goal is to abuse power. I think the Patriot Act is unnecessary/wrong not because of its abuse, but because our laws were working just fine prior to it. The whole notion that we should be worried about the PA because eventually we are all gonna be watched 24/7 is exactly the kind of trap you are gonna lose big time on because that level of surveillance is never gonna happen, making their argument more favorable because you were wrong about the government using the act for anything other than to "keep us safe." You are gonna look like a tin-foil hat... with foil covering all your electronics as well as your head, to keep "them" from listening in. "Morning Bill, what's the target up to at the moment?" "Hey Ted, he's listening to the RDJ album and is in the funny pictures thread on watmm.com" "Oh." "Yeah, but I suspect we are onto something big here Ted." "Well keep him monitored, we can't let anyone have privacy. It's too dangerous to us, to the Government. Good day."

At the end of the day the Patriot Act is more about political and social security for the two parties... its more about style than any substance... and yes there are more significant problems that should get more attention but don't because not everyone can be sent to Gitmo for example. Or be drone bombed in third world countries.

  On 9/7/2012 at 11:47 PM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

 

its just funny to me, I remember being around these boards when the Patriot Act was passed, or a little after that, and people were pretty fucking pissed.

 

Now 8-10 years later, its as normal as apple pie.

I'm not treating it as apple pie at all, I think the PA should be overturned... but not for the same reasons that you keep hinting towards or flat out saying. Your hypothesis is that we are gonna be living under a police state, where we can't say what we think politically or we will be tagged, monitored and put into a jail cell. This kind of rhetoric does not help overturn PA because it moves the goal post... it shifts the discussion from whether or not the PA should exist because it serves a necessary function, to whether or not the PA should exist because it might/probably maybe lead us to a police state.

  On 9/8/2012 at 12:13 AM, compson said:

  On 9/7/2012 at 11:47 PM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

its just funny to me, I remember being around these boards when the Patriot Act was passed, or a little after that, and people were pretty fucking pissed.

 

Now 8-10 years later, its as normal as apple pie.

 

I'm not treating it as apple pie at all, I think the PA should be overturned... but not for the same reasons that you keep hinting towards or flat out saying. Your hypothesis is that we are gonna be living under a police state, where we can't say what we think politically or we will be tagged, monitored and put into a jail cell. This kind of rhetoric does not help overturn PA because it moves the goal post... it shifts the discussion from whether or not the PA should exist because it serves a necessary function, to whether or not the PA should exist because it might/probably maybe lead us to a police state.

please don't put words in my mouth. i have nothing even remotely resembling that "hypothesis".

  On 9/8/2012 at 12:15 AM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

  On 9/8/2012 at 12:13 AM, compson said:

  On 9/7/2012 at 11:47 PM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

its just funny to me, I remember being around these boards when the Patriot Act was passed, or a little after that, and people were pretty fucking pissed.

 

Now 8-10 years later, its as normal as apple pie.

 

I'm not treating it as apple pie at all, I think the PA should be overturned... but not for the same reasons that you keep hinting towards or flat out saying. Your hypothesis is that we are gonna be living under a police state, where we can't say what we think politically or we will be tagged, monitored and put into a jail cell. This kind of rhetoric does not help overturn PA because it moves the goal post... it shifts the discussion from whether or not the PA should exist because it serves a necessary function, to whether or not the PA should exist because it might/probably maybe lead us to a police state.

 

please don't put words in my mouth. i have nothing even remotely resembling that "hypothesis".

My apologies then.

  On 9/7/2012 at 10:21 PM, oscillik said:

  On 9/7/2012 at 9:31 PM, luke viia said:

As an employee, can you read people's text messages? Do you know if anyone in your company has access to that info, and under what kind of circumstance they might be able to "need" access to it?

 

I don't have privileges to view content of text messages, but we (first line customer support) used to have that access. And those higher up than me certainly have access to this system.

 

  On 9/7/2012 at 9:31 PM, luke viia said:

do you know anything about APNs? (did I even ask that right?)

 

an APN is basically like a gateway.

 

you point your phone to your provider's APN and that APN gives you an IP address, and serves you internet traffic. Some providers have all traffic go through a proxy, which was the cause of some consternation recently and is something that other networks have done too (linked article in my post shows research by Collin Mulliner

Word, thanks for the insider info -- and regarding the APNs, I actually meant "Apple Push Notification Service" tokens, not Access Point Names... sorry for the confusion. Should have capitalized the S (APNS, or: a penis)

  On 9/8/2012 at 12:37 AM, luke viia said:

  On 9/7/2012 at 10:21 PM, oscillik said:

  On 9/7/2012 at 9:31 PM, luke viia said:

As an employee, can you read people's text messages? Do you know if anyone in your company has access to that info, and under what kind of circumstance they might be able to "need" access to it?

 

I don't have privileges to view content of text messages, but we (first line customer support) used to have that access. And those higher up than me certainly have access to this system.

 

  On 9/7/2012 at 9:31 PM, luke viia said:

do you know anything about APNs? (did I even ask that right?)

 

an APN is basically like a gateway.

 

you point your phone to your provider's APN and that APN gives you an IP address, and serves you internet traffic. Some providers have all traffic go through a proxy, which was the cause of some consternation recently and is something that other networks have done too (linked article in my post shows research by Collin Mulliner

 

Word, thanks for the insider info -- and regarding the APNs, I actually meant "Apple Push Notification Service" tokens, not Access Point Names... sorry for the confusion. Should have capitalized the S (APNS, or: a penis)

ahhh, Apple Push Notification Service. yeah I don't know shit about that. APNs are indeed a completely different kettle of fish, sorry I got the wrong end of the stick.

phew...good deal. Case solved then. Im happy to know that the US government isn't using electronic surveillance to monitor its citizens.

Haha! people always love a good conspiracy theory.....

don't lol quite yet http://forum.watmm.com/topic/75613-put-on-your-tinfoil-hats/