Going Veggie Again!

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:21 AM, sheatheman said:

Yes, most cheese is made with Rennet which is an amalgamation of enzymes harvested from bovine stomach lining.

 

Vegetarians have better sex.

 

Cheese also is made using casein which is the specific protein being used during The China Study linked on the last page. People might want to rethink their love affair with cheese.

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:26 AM, AdieuErsatzEnnui said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:21 AM, sheatheman said:

Yes, most cheese is made with Rennet which is an amalgamation of enzymes harvested from bovine stomach lining.

 

Vegetarians have better sex.

 

Cheese also is made using casein which is the specific protein being used during The China Study linked on the last page. People might want to rethink their love affair with cheese.

 

 

People also might want to rethink trusting inconclusive science that sounds appealing.

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:34 AM, fiznuthian said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:26 AM, AdieuErsatzEnnui said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:21 AM, sheatheman said:

Yes, most cheese is made with Rennet which is an amalgamation of enzymes harvested from bovine stomach lining.

 

Vegetarians have better sex.

 

Cheese also is made using casein which is the specific protein being used during The China Study linked on the last page. People might want to rethink their love affair with cheese.

 

 

People also might want to rethink trusting inconclusive science that sounds appealing.

 

 

 

What that casein is an inflammatory agent? That having inflamed cells are breeding ground for cancer?

Edited August 13, 2013 by AdieuErsatzEnnui

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:35 AM, AdieuErsatzEnnui said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:34 AM, fiznuthian said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:26 AM, AdieuErsatzEnnui said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:21 AM, sheatheman said:

Yes, most cheese is made with Rennet which is an amalgamation of enzymes harvested from bovine stomach lining.

 

Vegetarians have better sex.

 

Cheese also is made using casein which is the specific protein being used during The China Study linked on the last page. People might want to rethink their love affair with cheese.

 

 

People also might want to rethink trusting inconclusive science that sounds appealing.

 

 

 

What that casein is an inflammatory agent? That having inflamed cells are breeding ground for cancer?

 

 

No, that observational studies do not establish causation.

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:37 AM, fiznuthian said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:35 AM, AdieuErsatzEnnui said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:34 AM, fiznuthian said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:26 AM, AdieuErsatzEnnui said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:21 AM, sheatheman said:

Yes, most cheese is made with Rennet which is an amalgamation of enzymes harvested from bovine stomach lining.

 

Vegetarians have better sex.

 

Cheese also is made using casein which is the specific protein being used during The China Study linked on the last page. People might want to rethink their love affair with cheese.

 

 

People also might want to rethink trusting inconclusive science that sounds appealing.

 

 

 

What that casein is an inflammatory agent? That having inflamed cells are breeding ground for cancer?

 

 

No, that observational studies do not establish causation.

 

 

Well, I believe there has been a lot of good science about casein.

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:38 AM, AdieuErsatzEnnui said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:37 AM, fiznuthian said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:35 AM, AdieuErsatzEnnui said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:34 AM, fiznuthian said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:26 AM, AdieuErsatzEnnui said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:21 AM, sheatheman said:

Yes, most cheese is made with Rennet which is an amalgamation of enzymes harvested from bovine stomach lining.

 

Vegetarians have better sex.

 

Cheese also is made using casein which is the specific protein being used during The China Study linked on the last page. People might want to rethink their love affair with cheese.

 

 

People also might want to rethink trusting inconclusive science that sounds appealing.

 

 

 

What that casein is an inflammatory agent? That having inflamed cells are breeding ground for cancer?

 

 

No, that observational studies do not establish causation.

 

 

Well, I believe there has been a lot of good science about casein.

 

 

Can you post anything that isn't rat model?

i've heard more good things about casein

  Quote

 

 

T. Colin Campbell's The China Study (2005), a book, describes a direct correlation between casein administered to rats and the promotion of cancer cell growth when exposed to carcinogens. Aflatoxin (a potent carcinogen) was administered to these rats over a 2 week dosing period. The rats were given a 1 week post-dosing period before beginning the test (promotion period). During the promotion period, one group of rats was put on a 5% casein protein diet and another group on a 20% casein protein diet. None of the rats on 5% casein protein developed foci, precursors to cancerous cell growth, and every rat on 20% casein protein developed the pre-cancer foci. It should be noted that all test groups were fed a 20% casein diet for a total of 5 weeks (2-wk acclimation, 2-wk dosing, 1-wk post-dosing) prior to the 12 week promotion period in order to survive the initial aflatoxin B1 (AFB1) dosing, regardless of whether they were in the 5% or 20% test groups. Campbell has performed additional studies using a range of different carcinogens and other experimental animals, and claims to have found a consistent correlation between cancer growth and the amount of casein protein in diet.^[28] A 2001 study suggests another milk protein, whey protein, may play a protective role against colon tumors in rats.^[29] According to a study from the Australian Dairy Council, casein has antimutagenic effects.^[30]

 

Is this the research you speak of? Because I find it hard to believe that dosing rats with aflatoxin and feeding them casein (bovine protein no less.. do rats even eat animals?) is conclusive evidence for carcinogenesis in humans.

 

Also, Campbell is playing an alarmist game by promoting dangers of animal protein by generalizing from his rat model study testing casein. If you can dig up more research he's done or cited to back up his claims I would like to see it. He's essentially saying every animal protein is cancerous because casein did not inhibit growth in aflatoxin injected rats.

Edited August 13, 2013 by fiznuthian

  On 8/12/2013 at 11:06 PM, Terpentintollwut said:

@modey: Haha I have these all-time-fav-recipes as well, for me it's chili con carne I cook at least once a week. Also cumin in that one, and coriander, not powdered though, I use the seeds and mortar them to medium-sized bits.

 

I think you missed the tragic punchline of my story though - I accidentally fed the vegan cheese! I only noticed when he said he liked "that crumble-topping" .... I felt like I poisoned him or something. It's such an automatic thing to put parmesan on top ... I didn't realize. But then again, how the fuck do you not eat cheese, seriously. Vegetarian I can get but Vegan, come on ...

oh yeah haha. I put parmesan on it too. Cheese is the one reason why I could never be vegan. Oh, and the aforementioned cured pork sausages, zole.

i haven't had any meat for the past 12-13 years. instead i've been eating a shitload of processed soy products, fake meat/quorn and pasta. all day every day. im basically the worst vegetarian ever and i doubt im much better off than someone who's been eating cows every day for the past decade. been craving chicken drumsticks for about a year or two now but as of yet i haven't been able to bring myself to do it. it's like i've brainwashed myself. i feel weird just thinking about putting chicken in my mouth, even though i'd probably like it. what the shit is this post even about even. im thinking about going meaty again, thoughts?

 

 

 

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:45 AM, fiznuthian said:

 

  Quote

 

 

T. Colin Campbell's The China Study (2005), a book, describes a direct correlation between casein administered to rats and the promotion of cancer cell growth when exposed to carcinogens. Aflatoxin (a potent carcinogen) was administered to these rats over a 2 week dosing period. The rats were given a 1 week post-dosing period before beginning the test (promotion period). During the promotion period, one group of rats was put on a 5% casein protein diet and another group on a 20% casein protein diet. None of the rats on 5% casein protein developed foci, precursors to cancerous cell growth, and every rat on 20% casein protein developed the pre-cancer foci. It should be noted that all test groups were fed a 20% casein diet for a total of 5 weeks (2-wk acclimation, 2-wk dosing, 1-wk post-dosing) prior to the 12 week promotion period in order to survive the initial aflatoxin B1 (AFB1) dosing, regardless of whether they were in the 5% or 20% test groups. Campbell has performed additional studies using a range of different carcinogens and other experimental animals, and claims to have found a consistent correlation between cancer growth and the amount of casein protein in diet.^[28] A 2001 study suggests another milk protein, whey protein, may play a protective role against colon tumors in rats.^[29] According to a study from the Australian Dairy Council, casein has antimutagenic effects.^[30]

 

Is this the research you speak of? Because I find it hard to believe that dosing rats with aflatoxin and feeding them casein (bovine protein no less.. do rats even eat animals?) is conclusive evidence for carcinogenesis in humans.

 

Also, Campbell is playing an alarmist game by promoting dangers of animal protein by generalizing from his rat model study testing casein. If you can dig up more research he's done or cited to back up his claims I would like to see it. He's essentially saying every animal protein is cancerous because casein did not inhibit growth in aflatoxin injected rats.

 

 

I share your feelings about the experiment. I even voiced my opposition to its findings on the previous page. I was merely referencing it because it was posted to support a veggie diet by another user. I'm sure I could find more data on casein, but I think it is sort of scattered around and would take me quite a long time. Dave Asprey talks about some of the problems with casein. Mainly that many people are allergic to it and it is an inflammatory agent. He also states in the video I posted that while a lot of the findings from that experiment were nonsense that there was some relevant data. I'm sure you could find some interesting information about it if you look around, but honestly I don't have time to look for you. If someone were interested in casein as far as protein powder I might suggest hemp protein as a substitute.

i just like to kill things...

  On 8/13/2013 at 8:34 AM, AdieuErsatzEnnui said:

 

  On 8/13/2013 at 12:45 AM, fiznuthian said:

 

  Quote

T. Colin Campbell's [/size]The China Study (2005), a book, describes a direct correlation between casein administered to rats and the promotion of cancer cell growth when exposed to carcinogens. [/size]Aflatoxin (a potent carcinogen) was administered to these rats over a 2 week dosing period. The rats were given a 1 week post-dosing period before beginning the test (promotion period). During the promotion period, one group of rats was put on a 5% casein protein diet and another group on a 20% casein protein diet. None of the rats on 5% casein protein developed foci, precursors to cancerous cell growth, and every rat on 20% casein protein developed the pre-cancer foci. It should be noted that all test groups were fed a 20% casein diet for a total of 5 weeks (2-wk acclimation, 2-wk dosing, 1-wk post-dosing) prior to the 12 week promotion period in order to survive the initial aflatoxin B1 (AFB1) dosing, regardless of whether they were in the 5% or 20% test groups. Campbell has performed additional studies using a range of different carcinogens and other experimental animals, and claims to have found a consistent correlation between cancer growth and the amount of casein protein in diet.[/size]^%5B28%5D A 2001 study suggests another milk protein, [/size]whey protein, may play a protective role against colon tumors in rats.[/size]^%5B29%5D According to a study from the Australian Dairy Council, casein has antimutagenic effects.[/size]^%5B30%5D

Is this the research you speak of? Because I find it hard to believe that dosing rats with aflatoxin and feeding them casein (bovine protein no less.. do rats even eat animals?) is conclusive evidence for carcinogenesis in humans.

 

Also, Campbell is playing an alarmist game by promoting dangers of animal protein by generalizing from his rat model study testing casein. If you can dig up more research he's done or cited to back up his claims I would like to see it. He's essentially saying every animal protein is cancerous because casein did not inhibit growth in aflatoxin injected rats.

 

I share your feelings about the experiment. I even voiced my opposition to its findings on the previous page. I was merely referencing it because it was posted to support a veggie diet by another user. I'm sure I could find more data on casein, but I think it is sort of scattered around and would take me quite a long time. Dave Asprey talks about some of the problems with casein. Mainly that many people are allergic to it and it is an inflammatory agent. He also states in the video I posted that while a lot of the findings from that experiment were nonsense that there was some relevant data. I'm sure you could find some interesting information about it if you look around, but honestly I don't have time to look for you. If someone were interested in casein as far as protein powder I might suggest hemp protein as a substitute.

 

hmmm, consume something humans have almost never consumed (unregulated n untested too) vs something we've always consumed? i'm sure hemp protein is fine but weird suggestion.

 

edit: i threw a load of hemp protein powder in some rice i was cooking, some of formed little dumplings that (looked like shit but) tasted strangely pleasant

Edited August 13, 2013 by tauboo

I usually make sure to eat one or two medium-sized hares a day, or take at least a few sips of blended pork chops over the day, but yesterday... My boss kept throwing more spreadsheets at me to fill out, my wife was yelling at me to fix the air conditioning, and somewhere in between the spreadsheets and Fiona crying, I just FORGOT okay. Here goes my 5 years clean chip, I went veggie again folks.