Astrology

I remember reading about gravity somewhere and that we only see/experience a small fraction of gravity as most of it is lost in the other dimensions. I think it was an article about string theory but to say that these things don't have an effect on the body/mind when we don't full understand whats around is is a be naive.

  On 5/23/2014 at 11:24 AM, paranerd said:

There is no good evidence that the Moon effects behavior. The gravitational pull of your pillow at night is much stronger than the Moon. And electromagnetic fields are MUCH stronger on Earth than distant planets. If the celestial bodies have any influence on people, it's most probably psychological and not physical.

More pull on your pillow? the moon does a good job of changing the tides..

  On 5/23/2014 at 12:03 PM, miim said:

 

  On 5/23/2014 at 11:24 AM, paranerd said:

There is no good evidence that the Moon effects behavior. The gravitational pull of your pillow at night is much stronger than the Moon. And electromagnetic fields are MUCH stronger on Earth than distant planets. If the celestial bodies have any influence on people, it's most probably psychological and not physical.

More pull on your pillow? the moon does a good job of changing the tides..

 

Ah, it's because of this!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newton%27s_law_of_universal_gravitation

'Newton's law of universal gravitation states that any two bodies in the universe attract each other with a force that is directly proportional to the product of their masses and inversely proportional to the square of the distance between them.'

So your head laying on your pillow, because of the very short distance between the mass of your head and the mass of the pillow would have more of a gravitational effect than the distance of the Earth and the Moon with their individual mass.

Read the problematic aspects section on the same wiki....

Like I said before, shits fucked up.

Justbwhen we think we know what's going on new things changing everything.

I don't see how the 'Problematic Aspects' section is relevant in this case.

  On 5/23/2014 at 6:02 PM, miim said:

Like I said before, shits fucked up.
Just when we think we know what's going on new things changing everything.

Yes, things can change once more evidence comes to light - like general relativity mentioned in the above wiki article - but that doesn't give people the right to spout any idea they fancy as fact just because science changes our understanding of reality over time.

  On 5/21/2014 at 6:06 PM, Danny O Flannagin said:

So i'm doing a speech on how astrology is bullshit and a pseudo science with blatant over generalization and no real hard evidence to back it up.

Display descriptions of each sign's character traits with no mention of which sign is described. Get everyone to write down which best describes them. Tally up how many people choose the sign that they're supposed to be. If most people guess correctly, conclude that astrology is legit and read everyone their horoscope. Then denounce rationality.

So on a slightly unrelated note, my speech went pretty good and i got a few laughs out of the audience. It wasn't that serious and I was mainly poking fun at astrology in a playful way.

Before the speech I passed around a bunch of these to test that Forer effect:

  On 5/21/2014 at 6:26 PM, paranerd said:

'You have a need for other people to like and admire you, and yet you tend to be critical of yourself. While you have some personality weaknesses you are generally able to compensate for them. You have considerable unused capacity that you have not turned to your advantage. Disciplined and self-controlled on the outside, you tend to be worrisome and insecure on the inside. At times you have serious doubts as to whether you have made the right decision or done the right thing. You prefer a certain amount of change and variety and become dissatisfied when hemmed in by restrictions and limitations. You also pride yourself as an independent thinker; and do not accept others' statements without satisfactory proof. But you have found it unwise to be too frank in revealing yourself to others. At times you are extroverted, affable, and sociable, while at other times you are introverted, wary, and reserved. Some of your aspirations tend to be rather unrealistic.'

As I expected most people rated it 4 out of 5 in accuracy to themselves

I also had a Sagan quote at the end "The universe is not required to be in perfect harmony with human ambition"

Great!

    Quote

 

 

At times you are extroverted, affable, and sociable, while at other times you are introverted, wary, and reserved.

This shit! I had someone who was SO convinced astrology was legit that they gave me a full star chart/reading that was a few dozen pages. I actually humored them and read 2/3 of it and it was filled to the brim with cover-all-bases vague & contradictory statements like this. Needless to say I told them I thought it was BS and they said that I was just dissecting the language too much and playing devil's advocate because I'm an Aquarius.

  On 5/23/2014 at 9:22 PM, autopilot said:

 

    Quote

 

 

At times you are extroverted, affable, and sociable, while at other times you are introverted, wary, and reserved.

 

This shit! I had someone who was SO convinced astrology was legit that they gave me a full star chart/reading that was a few dozen pages. I actually humored them and read 2/3 of it and it was filled to the brim with cover-all-bases vague & contradictory statements like this. Needless to say I told them I thought it was BS and they said that I was just dissecting the language too much and playing devil's advocate because I'm an Aquarius.

 

Lol, this was a portion of the profile that I deliberately pointed out to the audience and i was like "look guys, that sentence applies to everyone in this room"

I enjoy reading horoscopes. Not because of some unproven scientific validity behind it. Because I really don't believe astrology has any scientific validity whatsoever. Not at this point, or anywhere in the future.

I enjoy horoscopes because they can present a different frame on things in life. And looking at life from different perspectives can always be helpful. Whether they are scientifically legitimate or not, it doesn't matter. If it can change my beliefs in a positive way, it can have a positive impact on my life. Because there's at least one aspect behind human behavior which has been proven scientifically since always, and that is that belief changes behavior.

Take research by Dan Ariely for instance. It's basically always about using a form of priming to see what the effect is on human behavior. So, in this sense you might argue that astrology uses scientifically proven instruments to change peoples behaviors. And reading a horoscope is not much more than an example of priming.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Priming_(psychology)

Again, I don't believe in the pseudo science aspect behind it. But, imo, that's not the point of astrology. Regardless of a couple of fruitcakes believing it is. Astrology is not science.

Although I could believe that your first experiences in life can change your outlook on life. So if your first experiences have been in a cold dark winter, your outlook could be different to someone whose first experiences were a bright hot summer. And because that's seasonal, there might be some seasonal correlation on personality. This has nothing to do with constellations though.

  On 5/24/2014 at 4:34 AM, goDel said:

I enjoy reading horoscopes. Not because of some unproven scientific validity behind it. Because I really don't believe astrology has any scientific validity whatsoever. Not at this point, or anywhere in the future.

 

I enjoy horoscopes because they can present a different frame on things in life. And looking at life from different perspectives can always be helpful. Whether they are scientifically legitimate or not, it doesn't matter. If it can change my beliefs in a positive way, it can have a positive impact on my life. Because there's at least one aspect behind human behavior which has been proven scientifically since always, and that is that belief changes behavior.

 

Take research by Dan Ariely for instance. It's basically always about using a form of priming to see what the effect is on human behavior. So, in this sense you might argue that astrology uses scientifically proven instruments to change peoples behaviors. And reading a horoscope is not much more than an example of priming.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Priming_(psychology)

 

Again, I don't believe in the pseudo science aspect behind it. But, imo, that's not the point of astrology. Regardless of a couple of fruitcakes believing it is. Astrology is not science.

 

Although I could believe that your first experiences in life can change your outlook on life. So if your first experiences have been in a cold dark winter, your outlook could be different to someone whose first experiences were a bright hot summer. And because that's seasonal, there might be some seasonal correlation on personality. This has nothing to do with constellations though.

Good post sir. 100% agree

Yes! Anything enjoyable or inspiring doesn't have to be completely scientific. If people like reading their horoscope or fortune cookies for the reasons you mentioned above, that's great. Like reading a novel, watching a film or playing a game. But when people treat astrology as a science it's similar to treating Star Wars as historical fact.

  On 5/23/2014 at 2:14 PM, paranerd said:

 

  On 5/23/2014 at 12:03 PM, miim said:

 

  On 5/23/2014 at 11:24 AM, paranerd said:

There is no good evidence that the Moon effects behavior. The gravitational pull of your pillow at night is much stronger than the Moon. And electromagnetic fields are MUCH stronger on Earth than distant planets. If the celestial bodies have any influence on people, it's most probably psychological and not physical.

More pull on your pillow? the moon does a good job of changing the tides..

 

Ah, it's because of this!

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newton%27s_law_of_universal_gravitation

 

'Newton's law of universal gravitation states that any two bodies in the universe attract each other with a force that is directly proportional to the product of their masses and inversely proportional to the square of the distance between them.'

 

So your head laying on your pillow, because of the very short distance between the mass of your head and the mass of the pillow would have more of a gravitational effect than the distance of the Earth and the Moon with their individual mass.

 

  On 5/23/2014 at 5:56 PM, miim said:

Read the problematic aspects section on the same wiki....

  On 5/23/2014 at 6:02 PM, miim said:

Like I said before, shits fucked up.

Justbwhen we think we know what's going on new things changing everything.

Actually, you can see how Newton's law helped us understand how planets form. Check this out:

http://integratedscienceathome.blogspot.com/2012/03/grains-of-salt-and-formation-of-planets.html

A simple experiment in space confirms the law since the particles in the bag are more attracted to each other than the gravity (mass) of the space station (or even the Earth, for that matter).

  On 5/23/2014 at 8:36 PM, Danny O Flannagin said:

So on a slightly unrelated note, my speech went pretty good and i got a few laughs out of the audience. It wasn't that serious and I was mainly poking fun at astrology in a playful way.

 

Before the speech I passed around a bunch of these to test that Forer effect:

 

  On 5/21/2014 at 6:26 PM, paranerd said:

'You have a need for other people to like and admire you, and yet you tend to be critical of yourself. While you have some personality weaknesses you are generally able to compensate for them. You have considerable unused capacity that you have not turned to your advantage. Disciplined and self-controlled on the outside, you tend to be worrisome and insecure on the inside. At times you have serious doubts as to whether you have made the right decision or done the right thing. You prefer a certain amount of change and variety and become dissatisfied when hemmed in by restrictions and limitations. You also pride yourself as an independent thinker; and do not accept others' statements without satisfactory proof. But you have found it unwise to be too frank in revealing yourself to others. At times you are extroverted, affable, and sociable, while at other times you are introverted, wary, and reserved. Some of your aspirations tend to be rather unrealistic.'

As I expected most people rated it 4 out of 5 in accuracy to themselves

 

I also had a Sagan quote at the end "The universe is not required to be in perfect harmony with human ambition"

Spot on! I hope some of them took something away from your speech.

  On 5/24/2014 at 5:34 AM, Timothy Forward said:

 

  On 5/24/2014 at 4:34 AM, goDel said:

 

Although I could believe that your first experiences in life can change your outlook on life. So if your first experiences have been in a cold dark winter, your outlook could be different to someone whose first experiences were a bright hot summer. And because that's seasonal, there might be some seasonal correlation on personality. This has nothing to do with constellations though.

 

Good post sir. 100% agree

 

Really like this last point you made although if that were true personality would be determined by where you live, which has some truth to it

  On 5/23/2014 at 6:02 PM, miim said:

Like I said before, shits fucked up.

Justbwhen we think we know what's going on new things changing everything.

You don't never going to know anything. We as a species dun never ever going to know anything. It's frustrating, but an essential hurdle to take in the becoming process.

Anyway, the topic.

Ah, astrology. I shied away from this thread, but now I feel compelled to have my say:

Present-day Garden Variety Astrology is mostly a load of crock, to that I agree: it's mostly veiled psychological advice to help lost souls feel better. This doesn't take away that I usually read the horoscopes, and if I find anything that can help me to forge a better outlook, that's good (godel said something along these lines)

I do hold the following belief, though: everything is connected. It's too bad that the connection between Humans and Stars is rapidly being discarded because of the diluted form of Astrology present in our world today. I think there are certain characteristics that can be linked to the Starchart hovering over your frail body the moment you slithered out of your mothers uterus. Oops, appearantly it's to do with the Sun's position on the day you were born

    Quote

"“When [astrologers] say that the sun is in Pisces, it’s really not in Pisces,” noted Parke Kunkle, a member of the group’s board. Your astrological sign is determined by the position of the sun on the day you were born, so that means everything you thought you knew about your horoscope is wrong."

Next to that, the position of our planets in accordance to the Earth and each other probably has an influence of some sorts too. I can never know for sure, but the planets have coexisted for a few billion years, and I sense that they have developed some form of mutual influence on eachother, which in turn would influence the dwellers of this Earth (the understanding of this goes way over my head though). This same train of thought goes for the connection between, let's say, Timmy and Taurus, Sol and Pleaides, or Me and Orion, but also Sol and ∞, ∞ and ∞, ∞ and you, you and me & me and ∞.

Anyway, the zodiacs we use today aren't even that relevant any more: when Zodiacs were dreamt into existence somewhat 3000 years ago, the dates corresponded with the times a zodiac was in the nightsky. However, due to the Earth's rotation, and the Moon's gravitational pull, the signs don't occupy the same space on our celestial charts anymore. The system is outdated. Now, new astrologers claim the following chart, with a new Zodiac called "Ophiuchus"

    Quote

Capricorn: Jan. 20-Feb. 16.

Aquarius: Feb. 16-March 11.

Pisces: March 11-April 18.

Aries: April 18-May 13.

Taurus: May 13-June 21.

Gemini: June 21-July 20.

Cancer: July 20-Aug. 10.

Leo: Aug. 10-Sept. 16.

Virgo: Sept. 16-Oct. 30.

Libra: Oct. 30-Nov. 23.

Scorpio: Nov. 23-29.

Ophiuchus: Nov. 29-Dec. 17.

Sagittarius: Dec. 17-Jan. 20.

Which would make a Libra instead of a Scorpio. I don't know what to think of this new sign (which appearantly is very old: Ancient Babylonians had 13 constellations but threw out Ophiuchus), but it's interesting to see that all the other Zodiacs have changed during the ages. If Astrology really wants to be taken seriously, it's got to adapt.

Also, the wisest of sages speak in the lowest of tones (which resonates with this iwc post)

  On 5/21/2014 at 8:43 PM, chim said:

 

there's another importance to consider, the biggest yappers of Astrology in the public eye are unfortunately usually very untrained with regard to the third eye and not spiritually inclined. those who take these subjects most seriously, by nature fly low, they talk rather softly yet intently, so pay attention if you happen to befriend one of these people...

Closing thoughts? A definitive connection between the Stars and You, but it mostly works in ways we can not fully comprehend.

I find the moral outrage about astrology as cheap as the blind faith in it. To point out that something is unscientific is not some profound observation. It's uninteresting to dismiss things for such reasons. It's way cooler to examine these symbols and contemplate the complex cultural and psychological role they have plaid throughout many civilizations for thousands of years. Pointing to horoscopes in the daily papers and being like "flol that's not rational omg just prove it with science you can't lol superstition" is pretty trite imo.

edit: Alcofribas -- Aquarius

  On 5/25/2014 at 7:36 PM, Alcofribas said:

edit: Alcofribas -- Aquarius

i knew it !

lol

  On 5/25/2014 at 7:16 PM, Phoenix said:

 

Also, the wisest of sages speak in the lowest of tones (which resonates with this iwc post)

 

  On 5/21/2014 at 8:43 PM, chim said:

 

there's another importance to consider, the biggest yappers of Astrology in the public eye are unfortunately usually very untrained with regard to the third eye and not spiritually inclined. those who take these subjects most seriously, by nature fly low, they talk rather softly yet intently, so pay attention if you happen to befriend one of these people...

 

Closing thoughts? A definitive connection between the Stars and You, but it mostly works in ways we can not fully comprehend.

 

me and chimera slot mom have become one. we are all one, omg

  On 5/26/2014 at 12:10 AM, impotentwhitecapitalist said:

 

  On 5/25/2014 at 7:16 PM, Phoenix said:

 

Also, the wisest of sages speak in the lowest of tones (which resonates with this iwc post)

 

  On 5/21/2014 at 8:43 PM, chim said:

 

there's another importance to consider, the biggest yappers of Astrology in the public eye are unfortunately usually very untrained with regard to the third eye and not spiritually inclined. those who take these subjects most seriously, by nature fly low, they talk rather softly yet intently, so pay attention if you happen to befriend one of these people...

 

Closing thoughts? A definitive connection between the Stars and You, but it mostly works in ways we can not fully comprehend.

 

 

 

me and chimera slot mom have become one. we are all one, omg

 

Prepare to be assimilated, resistance is futile.

oh lol, I thought I corrected this in the quote-section. Aw well, you are probably the same soul only 1/2 reincarnations away from eachother.

  On 5/26/2014 at 9:27 AM, chim said:

 

  On 5/26/2014 at 12:10 AM, impotentwhitecapitalist said:

 

  On 5/25/2014 at 7:16 PM, Phoenix said:

 

Also, the wisest of sages speak in the lowest of tones (which resonates with this iwc post)

 

  On 5/21/2014 at 8:43 PM, chim said:

 

there's another importance to consider, the biggest yappers of Astrology in the public eye are unfortunately usually very untrained with regard to the third eye and not spiritually inclined. those who take these subjects most seriously, by nature fly low, they talk rather softly yet intently, so pay attention if you happen to befriend one of these people...

 

Closing thoughts? A definitive connection between the Stars and You, but it mostly works in ways we can not fully comprehend.

 

 

 

me and chimera slot mom have become one. we are all one, omg

 

 

Prepare to be assimilated, resistance is futile.

 

 

 

  On 5/26/2014 at 12:10 AM, impotentwhitecapitalist said:

 

  On 5/25/2014 at 7:16 PM, Phoenix said:

 

Also, the wisest of sages speak in the lowest of tones (which resonates with this iwc post)

 

  On 5/21/2014 at 8:43 PM, chim said:

 

there's another importance to consider, the biggest yappers of Astrology in the public eye are unfortunately usually very untrained with regard to the third eye and not spiritually inclined. those who take these subjects most seriously, by nature fly low, they talk rather softly yet intently, so pay attention if you happen to befriend one of these people...

 

Closing thoughts? A definitive connection between the Stars and You, but it mostly works in ways we can not fully comprehend.

 

 

 

me and chimera slot mom have become one. we are all one, omg

 

Together you are .. CHIMPOTENT!!!!