Entering a music partnership, advice needed

Remember, you only once yolo.

I would be open to this. depending on the amount.

$500-$1,000 (depending on my situation-which rite now is okay enuf) YES

$1,000+ - NO

1k+ is really just too big of a chunk for me to invest liek that at this point

Only invest if you can handle saying goodbye to that amount of money and be ok with it.

If he does pay you back what you gave him are you done with after that?

Is it just a zero percent loan with no personal involvement essentially?

Are you ok with that? as you are key to him succeeding in his work. If he makes it and makes loads of money would you feel hard done by because you helped him and you got nothing out of it. No investment, No Nod of kudos etc.

It depends if you are going in to this as a friend or a with a business head. Investors would have a share in the brand and sometimes reduce the share once the initial money has been repaid but will be there until you write a new contract with buyout terms.

If you're going in as a friend then you're a good friend and make sure your eyes are wide open.

do it, but only on the condition of you shouting "DJ USAGI!" at least 3 times on every track he does. you'll be trying to pour champagne into a glass underwater in no time.

Have you heard some demos of this new stuff he's thinking about? Is it good? Regardless of how busy he is, seems he should be putting together some demos or rough ideas of these tracks, otherwise I wonder about his ability to actually pump them out while money is burning in the studio ya know?

BCM has good advice.

lots of negative nancys in here. I say do it, as long as the contract is looked over by a legal person and seems legit. that needs to be legally water-tight, don't forget this is a risk for him too (to pay back your money)

Think of it as positive artistic patronage. Do this ONLY if you believe in this guy and his music and his art. Just because you are old drinkin mates and listened to syro one time doesn't cut it for me. If you think of it as a get rich quick scheme, it isn't. You are supporting an artist you believe in and that is good karma. If you get a little extra money because of it, good on you for supporting him.

I would also not just give him the money and sit back. I would give him the money and then spend some time promoting the shit out of him DJ Khaled style. This is an investment. People are idiots and buy into that shit regardless of artistic merit and quality.

  On 11/11/2015 at 5:05 PM, dr lopez said:

I would also not just give him the money and sit back. I would give him the money and then spend some time promoting the shit out of him DJ Khaled style. This is an investment. People are idiots and buy into that shit regardless of artistic merit and quality.

Give him money and do his work for him? I get what you're saying but this seems a sucker move.

yeah but "DJ USAGI!"...

he's gonna be massive and i want in. can i invest in you please usagi? fuck this other guy.

ha, yeah, do it, DO IT!

  On 11/11/2015 at 11:22 AM, usagi said:

 

this guy is a friend.

i read this twice in a row somehow inadvertently as 'this guy is a fraud' so my gut tells me its prob not a good idea

Just as long as you're prepared to have this happen to your cash dolla:

Gimme a thousand.

Anotha one.

if you can be ok with the money being gone and not coming back and have it be worth it to do the thing and it will be a good time, then that sounds cool

  On 11/11/2015 at 5:11 PM, BCM said:

yeah but "DJ USAGI!"...

 

he's gonna be massive and i want in. can i invest in you please usagi? fuck this other guy.

Fuck yes, WATMM crowd funding DJ Usagi and EKT making sick beats we can manufacture the shit out of this and all be millionaires in a couple of years time and have hot tubs full of smart women

Sweet Uggi, the only thing I can add at this stage that hasn't already been said is to consider whatever contract you enter into to be effectively worthless; essentially you'd just be lending this guy money in good faith.

Say he fails to live up to his end of the terms and is unable or unwilling to pay you - what's your recourse? Do y'all have small claims courts there? Would you have the time and resources to go that route if it came to it? What you and I (and most people reading this) consider to be a large sum of money ain't shit when it comes to the courts and lawyers.

best way to find out is to try it and find out. consider it a lesson. i suppose the money is going to renting the studio space then? why is he asking money from you? what are you buying in to really? equipment? real estate? babymaking?

btw i did read the op, forgive me if i forgot it.

  On 11/11/2015 at 1:59 PM, QQQ said:

 

  On 11/11/2015 at 1:44 PM, oscillik said:

it sounds like you've already made your mind up

This.

 

nope. I'm not moving on this yet. I'm just not hearing any worthwhile counterarguments other than WATMM's natural mistrust and risk-aversion.

  On 11/11/2015 at 2:29 PM, Phlexunger said:

I fully understood what you were asking

I did not assume the guy was a noob nor a crook

 

However

even established artists loose money on releases

That is not to say don't do it

 

I believe anyone can do anything if they put their mind to it

and if they make a good plan

 

Also

if they consider their downside and take precautions on their downside

minimizing their risk

 

The thought I suggested is based on your question of investment risk

It's common sense investing to consider your odds and if they are 50 50

that is a bad investment with too much risk

 

Now if you try and make the odds better by minimizing the risk

you can be less speculative about your return

 

If you feel that his promise to pay it back is bond then why did you need reassurance ?

 

I think its very noble of you to support the arts in this manner

I am just saying to protect yourself

be aware of your downside and try and hedge against it

 

That is not a character judgement on your artist

you are investing in an artist and project

If you use the investment strategy of downside protection

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/downside-protection.asp

 

You can come up with whatever protective plan that makes sense to you

I was just giving you an example

fair enough, thank you. I am aware of how cutthroat the industry is and that many artists don't make anything, really. however I can't see a way to hedge this. how would you? seems like you just have to roll the dice if you want to play.

some things do lessen the risk in this case, I mean if this were someone who hadn't released any albums on labels before or had never toured or done regular gigs before, then I'd definitely be saying no for the amount that's been asked. but this guy is more proven.

  On 11/11/2015 at 2:32 PM, MDM Chaos said:

does he have full details of sales figures of his previous work? you need to calculate your possible ROI. treat it like a normal business venture.

ROI will be discussed.

  On 11/11/2015 at 3:29 PM, colunga said:

I would be open to this. depending on the amount.

$500-$1,000 (depending on my situation-which rite now is okay enuf) YES

$1,000+ - NO

 

1k+ is really just too big of a chunk for me to invest liek that at this point

lol. no disrespect here but it's clear that not many of you have any experience with this. we're talking 3 singles, an album and a label deal and you're thinking of it in terms of whether it's less than or more than one g. come on, yo.

I regret starting this thread. although it has been helpful hearing from a couple of people who have more experience/knowledge.

  On 11/11/2015 at 3:42 PM, Chesney said:

Only invest if you can handle saying goodbye to that amount of money and be ok with it.

If he does pay you back what you gave him are you done with after that?

Is it just a zero percent loan with no personal involvement essentially?

Are you ok with that? as you are key to him succeeding in his work. If he makes it and makes loads of money would you feel hard done by because you helped him and you got nothing out of it. No investment, No Nod of kudos etc.

It depends if you are going in to this as a friend or a with a business head. Investors would have a share in the brand and sometimes reduce the share once the initial money has been repaid but will be there until you write a new contract with buyout terms.

If you're going in as a friend then you're a good friend and make sure your eyes are wide open.

sigh, read OP.

but yes, the possibility that it might get big and then I'd have to cash out after 2 years is not ideal, and that is something that has already been flagged for discussion. a new contract with updated terms might be ideal, depending on the circumstances.

I'm going in as a friend but not without business sense. or I'm trying to.

  On 11/11/2015 at 4:57 PM, BCM said:

do it, but only on the condition of you shouting "DJ USAGI!" at least 3 times on every track he does. you'll be trying to pour champagne into a glass underwater in no time.

this will be in the contract if things proceed, as a make-or-break clause.

  On 11/11/2015 at 5:04 PM, cult fiction said:

Have you heard some demos of this new stuff he's thinking about? Is it good? Regardless of how busy he is, seems he should be putting together some demos or rough ideas of these tracks, otherwise I wonder about his ability to actually pump them out while money is burning in the studio ya know?

yes, I've heard demos. that was the first thing we did. I've also heard his released work.

  On 11/11/2015 at 5:05 PM, dr lopez said:

BCM has good advice.

 

lots of negative nancys in here. I say do it, as long as the contract is looked over by a legal person and seems legit. that needs to be legally water-tight, don't forget this is a risk for him too (to pay back your money)

 

Think of it as positive artistic patronage. Do this ONLY if you believe in this guy and his music and his art. Just because you are old drinkin mates and listened to syro one time doesn't cut it for me. If you think of it as a get rich quick scheme, it isn't. You are supporting an artist you believe in and that is good karma. If you get a little extra money because of it, good on you for supporting him.

 

I would also not just give him the money and sit back. I would give him the money and then spend some time promoting the shit out of him DJ Khaled style. This is an investment. People are idiots and buy into that shit regardless of artistic merit and quality.

patronage is the primary motivation. however there is scope for more. and if I am indeed going to have a more active part in the project and not sit back (manager-type responsibilities) then I have to think about the business side of things too. for the amount I'm investing, which I have available now but which is definitely not something I can just shake a stick at, the real question is whether or not there'll be enough on top of it by the end of the 2 years for it to be justified, as a business venture. that's ze rub.

if it were just patronage, then fuck yeah, no problem. if I were older and settled and more secure, then I'd do this with a lot more ease of mind.

  On 11/11/2015 at 7:39 PM, Bob Dobalina said:

Sweet Uggi, the only thing I can add at this stage that hasn't already been said is to consider whatever contract you enter into to be effectively worthless; essentially you'd just be lending this guy money in good faith.

 

Say he fails to live up to his end of the terms and is unable or unwilling to pay you - what's your recourse? Do y'all have small claims courts there? Would you have the time and resources to go that route if it came to it? What you and I (and most people reading this) consider to be a large sum of money ain't shit when it comes to the courts and lawyers.

yeah, we do have small claims court. but honestly, even accounting for our plebby incomes, I don't think this would be a matter for small claims, if it came to that. I would go to court if I have to.

I feel what you're saying about the contract. if ultimately it is dependent on good faith regardless of what is signed/not signed, then really, there are few other people I know that I would put this faith in. of course that on its own is not a good basis to proceed, but yeah. the other factors kind of incline me to do this right now.

  On 11/11/2015 at 7:47 PM, skibby said:

best way to find out is to try it and find out. consider it a lesson. i suppose the money is going to renting the studio space then? why is he asking money from you? what are you buying in to really? equipment? real estate? babymaking?

 

btw i did read the op, forgive me if i forgot it.

he has studio space, shit is sorted. some of the money will probably go towards living expenses, that's part of the idea of giving the man breathing room from working/gigging all the time. and yes, I know you guys probably can't stomach that, but I'm closer to the situation and I'm not so antsy about it provided everything else works out.

a spending plan is in the works, I'll be reviewing that soon.

  On 11/11/2015 at 5:20 PM, John Ehrlichman said:

 

  On 11/11/2015 at 11:22 AM, usagi said:

 

this guy is a friend.

i read this twice in a row somehow inadvertently as 'this guy is a fraud' so my gut tells me its prob not a good idea

 

lol I also read that quote as "this guy is a fraud."

  On 11/12/2015 at 5:25 AM, Mesh Gear Fox said:

hey dj usagi how are you choons going? got a soundclown account set up yet? can't wait 2 hear the bangers you and your mate make together! lol :cat:

yeah I'm getting mad phonecalls from the CEO of Bleep and I'm like "for fucksake I'm tryna write these fuckin' choons man"

lol

fair enough, thank you. I am aware of how cutthroat the industry is and that many artists don't make anything, really. however I can't see a way to hedge this. how would you? seems like you just have to roll the dice if you want to play.

some things do lessen the risk in this case, I mean if this were someone who hadn't released any albums on labels before or had never toured or done regular gigs before, then I'd definitely be saying no for the amount that's been asked. but this guy is more proven.

well if that is the case then you believe in the artist and his past history

They say the key to wealth is giving more than receiving

In this case you should do well because you are giving to this situation

However a smart business move is protecting your downside

I gave you an example but without knowing the situation specifics

I can't come up with good suggestions

However I will say this

It's good investing practice to have double what you invest

so for example if your investment is 2000 you should have 4000

that extra 2000 protects your possible loss

I tried to give you an earning and or creating new money strategy

rather than using money you have in your checking account

create new money to invest to this so if you start to loose money

you can think of it as "found" money rather than money you had

As I said my specific suggestions will be useless to you

but I am saying consider investment strategic planing even if this is music

and the labor of love. Your not a industry scumbag for being smart with your money allocation

It will be good business for you and your friend and help the longevity of the project

Forget about the cut throat greater music industry all of us who make this music

are somewhat outside of that anyway but that does not mean we have to plan on loosing money

or failing.

If you believe in your artist and you are willing to make this selfless contribution

the law of giving actually says your ahead

pair that with a protecting your downside and being on top of your growth and you should do fine

I wish I had a friend like you for my music

Bravo !

  On 11/11/2015 at 7:01 PM, Timothy Forward said:

 

  On 11/11/2015 at 5:11 PM, BCM said:

yeah but "DJ USAGI!"...

 

he's gonna be massive and i want in. can i invest in you please usagi? fuck this other guy.

 

Fuck yes, WATMM crowd funding DJ Usagi and EKT making sick beats we can manufacture the shit out of this and all be millionaires in a couple of years time and have hot tubs full of smart women

 

holy crap why didn't i think of that! yes crowdfund the production! part of the package for backers can be a copy of the finished LP.

if you can't find backers for the project to fulfill the budget, then it's surely a sign the business idea was a dud anyway.

(for some reason i'm now imagining the female terminator in liquid form filling a bath with just her face visible)

UU CAT001 - Ceephax feat. Big Cummy, Grace Jones & Master Pee - Urinary Traxxx

ready