Elon Musk is a Nazi - Is this shitty future real wtf

Wow, straw man argument incoming!

I understand you think my argument isn't a good one, but it's in no way a straw man

You're changing the focus of the subject onto me instead of addressing the facts. That is by definition a straw man argument.

http://www.logicalfallacies.info/ambiguity/straw-man/

I think he articulated it fairly well.

How is it Elon Musks' responsibility to solve homelessness and world hunger any more than it is your own responsibility.

Not a strawman.

As for moving back to the original subject: Perhaps we should use those seemingly limitless resources of money to make sure that everyone gets a fair shake in society. Maybe everyone should get fed and everyone should have shelter. Throwing a car into space isn't exactly progress to me.

It wasn't (and isn't) about throwing a car into space. 

Pretty sure food/shelter is what your government is for, not private citizens?

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:05 AM, Bulk VanderHooj said:

I think he articulated it fairly well.

 

How is it Elon Musks' responsibility to solve homelessness and world hunger any more than it is your own responsibility.

 

Not a strawman.

Because he has a billion dollars and I don't. If you're trying to equate my position in a capitalist society equal to his as far as giving power, then you're sorely out of touch.

Elon donates 10s of millions of dollars, just not to food/shelter/water.

It just seems like a weird comment that by virtue of his fortune he is suddenly responsible for fixing food and homelessness like that's anything to do with him. 

There are very real and very useful applications for the stuff spaceX, tesla etc is researching (and doing) - to chalk it up to throwing a car into space is disingenuous. 

My point is that it's no measure of progress because we haven't even solved the simplest of problems humanity creates for itself.

/lastpost

Well, now that's a fair statement that is much different than what you said before.

You should have said that to begin with.

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:02 AM, Braintree said:

You're changing the focus of the subject onto me instead of addressing the facts. That is by definition a straw man argument.

 

http://www.logicalfallacies.info/ambiguity/straw-man/

The link you posted doesn't support what you're saying at all.  Maybe it could be weakly called an ad hominem argument but it's not a straw man, that's a different fallacy entirely.  I didn't misrepresent what you were saying and attack a misrepresentation, which is what a straw man is.

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:07 AM, Braintree said:

Perhaps we should use those seemingly limitless resources of money to make sure that everyone gets a fair shake in society.

He earned that money by participating in the capitalist process that creates those problems in the first place

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:34 AM, span said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:07 AM, Braintree said:

Perhaps we should use those seemingly limitless resources of money to make sure that everyone gets a fair shake in society.

He earned that money by participating in the capitalist process that creates those problems in the first place

 

Yeah, helping with the creation of PayPal to undercut incumbent payment processors and allow anyone to be a seller online causes capitalist problems.  Helping with the creation of a new era where electric cars are soon going to become dominant is causing all sorts of capitalist problems.  Making space flight cheaper by creating reusable rockets instead of throwaway ones makes capitalist problems worse

The naivete in this thread...

Didn't paypal help out with stopping payment towards sources that those in control deemed unworthy/a threat or something equally odious and totalitarian?

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:46 AM, Zeffolia said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:34 AM, span said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:07 AM, Braintree said:

Perhaps we should use those seemingly limitless resources of money to make sure that everyone gets a fair shake in society.

He earned that money by participating in the capitalist process that creates those problems in the first place

 

 

Yeah, helping with the creation of PayPal to undercut incumbent payment processors and allow anyone to be a seller online causes capitalist problems.  Helping with the creation of a new era where electric cars are soon going to become dominant is causing all sorts of capitalist problems.  Making space flight cheaper by creating reusable rockets instead of throwaway ones makes capitalist problems worse

 

The naivete in this thread...

 

"What he made had some positive impact which means it had no negative impact at all"

Also I'm not talking about the end results, I'm talking about the means used to achieve them

  On 2/12/2018 at 1:14 AM, span said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:46 AM, Zeffolia said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:34 AM, span said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:07 AM, Braintree said:

Perhaps we should use those seemingly limitless resources of money to make sure that everyone gets a fair shake in society.

He earned that money by participating in the capitalist process that creates those problems in the first place

 

 

Yeah, helping with the creation of PayPal to undercut incumbent payment processors and allow anyone to be a seller online causes capitalist problems.  Helping with the creation of a new era where electric cars are soon going to become dominant is causing all sorts of capitalist problems.  Making space flight cheaper by creating reusable rockets instead of throwaway ones makes capitalist problems worse

 

The naivete in this thread...

 

"What he made had some positive impact which means it had no negative impact at all"

 

Also I'm not talking about the end results, I'm talking about the means used to achieve them

 

What means used to achieve them?  You have to list them or your claims are worthless

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:52 AM, hello spiral said:

Didn't paypal help out with stopping payment towards sources that those in control deemed unworthy/a threat or something equally odious and totalitarian?

Probably - PayPal is indeed pretty shit in a lot of areas and it's not a perfect solution like crypto is.  But it's better to have credit cards + PayPal than just credit cards.  It was revolutionary for its time and extremely disruptive, helping a lot of online small business owners to actually have a chance as opposed to having literally no practical way to conduct their business at all.  Undoubtedly a net gain for society at the time despite it being shit now in comparison to alternatives.

  On 2/12/2018 at 1:39 AM, Zeffolia said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 1:14 AM, span said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:46 AM, Zeffolia said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:34 AM, span said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 12:07 AM, Braintree said:

Perhaps we should use those seemingly limitless resources of money to make sure that everyone gets a fair shake in society.

He earned that money by participating in the capitalist process that creates those problems in the first place

 

 

Yeah, helping with the creation of PayPal to undercut incumbent payment processors and allow anyone to be a seller online causes capitalist problems.  Helping with the creation of a new era where electric cars are soon going to become dominant is causing all sorts of capitalist problems.  Making space flight cheaper by creating reusable rockets instead of throwaway ones makes capitalist problems worse

 

The naivete in this thread...

 

"What he made had some positive impact which means it had no negative impact at all"

 

Also I'm not talking about the end results, I'm talking about the means used to achieve them

 

 

What means used to achieve them?  You have to list them or your claims are worthless

 

I've no specific issues with Elon in particular, I was just replying to Braintree's point about Elon using his money for 'good', as in, using it to feed the homeless and make sure everyone gets food and whatever. Just pointing that you can't solve this system's problems from within the system. I'm too tired and ignorant to elaborate on this, but you can't just profit from the current system, create or enable (directly or indirectly) those problems Braintree mentions, then throw money at them to somehow solve them

  On 2/12/2018 at 1:39 AM, Zeffolia said:

it's not a perfect solution like crypto is

what is crypto the solution to?

it's the space age for people who like avocado toast, saying "yassss", watching stranger things, and posting on twitter that they value their relationships with dogs over their human relationships

I'm with Braintree, go socialism!

  On 2/12/2018 at 4:27 AM, zaphod said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 1:39 AM, Zeffolia said:

it's not a perfect solution like crypto is

 

what is crypto the solution to?

 

To all currency, monetary policy, wealth management, and anonymous payment related problems.  Before we needed third party intermediaries to hold our money in between a transaction - now we can just give money directly to the person even if we don't know who they are

Here we go again...

Last time I checked having 2 electric vehicle companies and a solar panel company was beneficial for humanity and that's good enough for me and It would be just as good under any other economical system.

  On 2/12/2018 at 10:56 AM, Kidrodi said:

Last time I checked having 2 electric vehicle companies and a solar panel company was beneficial for humanity and that's good enough for me and It would be just as good under any other economical system.

  On 2/12/2018 at 11:06 AM, MIXL2 said:

 

  On 2/12/2018 at 10:56 AM, Kidrodi said:

Last time I checked having 2 electric vehicle companies and a solar panel company was beneficial for humanity and that's good enough for me and It would be just as good under any other economical system.

iunno man imo is p shitty, why doesn't he give me all his money instead of investing in shit? p shitty imho

 

i kno man, heck him tbh