The NTS Sessions do not sound algorithmic

  On 5/15/2018 at 9:51 AM, phudoshin said:

I've got my kabuki suit ready so I can sneak up on the 'chre in dublin in the dark and take a gander at what they does with thems buttons

They just double click max.exe at the start of the gig and then pretend, they learned the technique from Justice:

The NTS Sessions do not sound algorithmic

no shit. it's called "max". they do sound "max"... like... max msp brah.

But they sure sound O R G A S M I C amiright?! 

Idiot question: Anyone know what NTS actually stands for? Just out of curiosity.

Nuts To Soup

Nazi Tourism Society

NTS stands for "Pitchfork is a bunch of thundercuNTS"

we need the soundboad patch

Are the NTS sessions gluten-free?

from the bleachbloke review: 

But their primary tool is Max/MSP, a visual programming language that allows them to create generative algorithms that in effect compose themselves.

I think the sessions might be partially-hydrogenated...

In case you're keeping score at home or planning for an upcoming fantasy league draft, lianne has been one of the most consistent ae subforum shitposters for years now, with a WBT (wolfbait/thread) off the charts

  On 5/15/2018 at 8:17 AM, Chabraendeky said:

Greek joke:

 

Is algorhythm a beat that causes pain?

if it's a non-Euclidean trampoline wtf direction are you jumping in

Edit: I read "pretend" and "Justice" when did this become a political discussion

A shit thread was not so intended...

I was responding to some things I’ve read (and said) about our these tracks sounding like captures from somewhere in a patch, rather the ‘craft’ (as someone put it) feel of Draft 7.30 or whatever. I think was trying to point out how this music is so great and different from stuff I’ve heard other guys do that is being generated by a patch it transcends tools or feeling like it comes from any one approach. Was meant to be complementing Ae on their mastery. :D

But I guess it didn’t make sense to anyone and so may indeed another unintended crap thread. I don’t use these tools so should probably not comment. I like reading others write ‘behind the scenes’ reverse engineering though!

It was interesting to find out about Arvo Part in that way though.

The water does not feel wet

I think that the conversation was interesting and inspirational here. So I don't understand why it should be a "shit topic".

We all have different backgrounds it's good to discuss what we think about algorithmic or generative music. It's obviously part of the Ae-mythology, so why should be this theme banned?

  On 5/16/2018 at 1:45 PM, Chabraendeky said:

 It's obviously part of the Ae-mythology, so why should be this theme banned?

that's the thing: obvious point is obvious and the theme so discussed to death around here it's meme-material at best really.

also:

  On 5/14/2018 at 3:07 PM, hello spiral said:

lol what does this even mean

  On 5/16/2018 at 1:54 PM, jaderpansen said:

 

  On 5/16/2018 at 1:45 PM, Chabraendeky said:

 It's obviously part of the Ae-mythology, so why should be this theme banned?

 

that's the thing: obvious point is obvious and the theme so discussed to death around here it's meme-material at best really.

 

also:

 

  On 5/14/2018 at 3:07 PM, hello spiral said:

lol what does this even mean

 

can you generate memes in Max/MSP

  On 5/16/2018 at 2:11 PM, Ragnar said:

 

  On 5/16/2018 at 1:54 PM, jaderpansen said:

 

  On 5/16/2018 at 1:45 PM, Chabraendeky said:

 It's obviously part of the Ae-mythology, so why should be this theme banned?

 

that's the thing: obvious point is obvious and the theme so discussed to death around here it's meme-material at best really.

 

also:

 

  On 5/14/2018 at 3:07 PM, hello spiral said:

lol what does this even mean

 

can you generate memes in Max/MSP

the interesting question is: would it still be ME egenrating them memnes or the algorythm??

But this Max/MSP thing , is it out yet ?

  On 5/16/2018 at 2:19 PM, jaderpansen said:

 

  On 5/16/2018 at 2:11 PM, Ragnar said:

 

  On 5/16/2018 at 1:54 PM, jaderpansen said:

 

  On 5/16/2018 at 1:45 PM, Chabraendeky said:

It's obviously part of the Ae-mythology, so why should be this theme banned?

that's the thing: obvious point is obvious and the theme so discussed to death around here it's meme-material at best really.

 

also:

  On 5/14/2018 at 3:07 PM, hello spiral said:

lol what does this even mean

can you generate memes in Max/MSP

the interesting question is: would it still be ME egenrating them memnes or the algorythm??

Ultimate answer to the generative drama (great interview tbh: https://archive.li/WuBgz#selection-619.0-216.351)

AR - Generative music... 

SB - Well, no no what is generative music? 

AR - Algorithmic music, random elements in system... 

SB - This is the part you don't understand. You don't know what you're talking about. Do you know anything about generative music? 

AR - Generative to me means generative algorithms, evolving systems of... 

SB - So you know about mapping complex numbers against imaginary numbers, but what can you tell me about our music? Do you actually know anything about the way that we make music, or are we speculating? (laughs) 

AR - I am speculating, so tell me... 

SB - For start, the word 'random' -- it takes the shit right out of me. There's absolutely nothing random about what we do. There might be a lot of number crunching going on but there's nothing random in there. 

AR - So you're not making instantaneous decisions based on whatever the computer is spitting out at a given time? 

SB - Well I don't know, it depends what kind of action or reaction to a situation you've got. I mean, yeah, if I'm controlling a patch that behaves recursively then there's a vague quantum where I can only use my ears to determine exactly what's going on process-wise because I couldn't possibly see and process the numbers in realtime. Any sort of perceptive reaction on my part is going to play a part in the way that we react to the system, or the way we react as part of the system, but, like any quantum value as soon as you kind of ascertain what it is it changes. The problem with it is that it crumbles as soon as you discuss it. 

I mean, all music is generative. Okay, any music. There's no.. as long as there's a rule and there's a determination in terms of process and you've got an algorithm. Any music can be broken down like that. I mean, it's really easy, the algorithm just becomes more complex in certain cases and simple in others. It might not have anything to do with how the music sounds, either. It might not be exactly directly or indirectly related. No, I don't use random number generators -- I fucking hate em. They're rubbish. I use a few chaotic operators but in terms of how much of it is bound to the system, I'm not really sure. Um, it's kinda like saying, if you program a drum machine, that the drum machine is writing the track. If that's the case, then we might as well not bother doing anything. I mean, should we give up? (laughs) 

AR - What I mean is, is the instrument a third member of the group... 

SB - No not at all. It just facilitates. It's just tools. 

AR - Seems chaotic, like you're on the edge of losing control.. 

SB - The software is available, so as far as we're concerned we have to consider its use, and so we apply it where it is necessary, where it seems applicable. I mean, you know, they are tools, we're the people that are using them, there's a definite distinction got to be made -- you can't start treating software like it's got a personality or taste, you know? Taste is what defines people, it's what makes us different to software -- we're not software, you can't possibly consider a bit of software to be like a person. It's not 2001 -- I mean, it is, but it's not. We're not talking about fucking HAL, we're talking about a few bits of number crunching objects that don't really do a great deal until you feed them numbers and tell what to come out with. 

It's like any generative processes are so-called lifelike algorithms; it's like cellular automatons supposedly replicating life-type behavior, it's fucking rubbish. They don't do anything of the sort, but they make really nice patterns. But I wouldn't imbue them with intelligence, just because there is intelligence behind their creation. It's like saying pyramids are clever. 

It's silly, really. Yeah, I'm well into like messing with algorithms, 'cause I like the way things can interfere with each other, but... and I really like the exactitude of control you can get and the amount of math you can have within your system, or amount of system within the system, you know. I don't think any different now, to the way I felt when I was plugging a 202 into a delay unit that reads the square wave and generates a delay at that pitch and then changing the square wave width so that the delay unit gets confused. I don't feel any different now to the way I felt then, it's just the same, I mean, the fact that we're using computers to do it now, just makes it different set of criteria, different quanta. 

I suppose the best part about it is designing systems from the outset using raw components, but that's not really different any from knocking PCBs up in college, so. It's all the same kind of thing, really. Electronics and the kinds of systems we use for programming are dead similar, that's probably why I use them. I don't do a great deal of codebase stuff, I'm pretty shit with code. 

Haven't seen that interview in a while. There's definitely generative music out there, but it's definitely not very good without editing/intervention/etc...in my experience, my opinion.

Funny now in retrospect Sean saying the software isn't a 'third member of the group' when that last Resident Advisor interview they said the exact opposite. A lot's changed in ~15 years. 

Also lol this thread.