Obama authorizes assassination of US citizen

one last thing i wanted to say is one of the most troubling and telling aspects of this policy is just how far we've sunken as a nation about standing up for our own intelligence

this law basically says that you must trust the authoritarian role by the US government to tell you truthfully and factually that yes this person is 100% a 'terrorist' who is trying to kill you and because of that he is a danger to society and must be killed. No due process, no arrest, no lawyer, nothing, just straight up kill.

How did we get to the point where we put so much blind faith and trust into a government that has lied to us more times than we can count? I mean im not saying that you should disbeleive 100% of what you hear from the government, but something as extreme as putting one of our own citizens to death without actual criminal charges, i think thats pretty hardcore and deserves much questioning. And what's devastating is if Bush were doing this, the same people who voted for Obama and are silent in criticizing him would have been FURIOUS at george w bush for doing this, they would have called it one of the grossest violations of civil rights in the modern era

  On 4/11/2010 at 12:47 AM, Awepittance said:

 

 

How did we get to the point where we put so much blind faith and trust into a government that has lied to us more times than we can count?

No one cares. American Idol is more important.

maybe, but if this was Bush doing it people like Michael Moore, Olbermann, George Soros/moveon.org would be rallying the left to go after him.

  On 4/11/2010 at 12:52 AM, Awepittance said:

maybe, but if this was Bush doing it people like Michael Moore, Olbermann, George Soros/moveon.org would be rallying the left to go after him.

well , bush kind of did it (With the patriot act) , Our protests were peaceful (Apart from a few anarchists)

Also , Keith Olbermann criticized Obama for the whole "authorized assassination" deal

yes he did, and it was extremely out of character for him to do that. I give him credit for it

  On 4/11/2010 at 12:56 AM, Boxing Day said:

  On 4/11/2010 at 12:52 AM, Awepittance said:

maybe, but if this was Bush doing it people like Michael Moore, Olbermann, George Soros/moveon.org would be rallying the left to go after him.

 

 

well , bush kind of did it (With the patriot act) , Our protests were peaceful (Apart from a few anarchists)

i think you're missing my larger point, i wasn't trying to say that rallying people against bad policies was in any way a negative thing

i am trying to point out the hypocricy, the team loyalty and the blind faith that people have in somebody once they vote for them. It's like they can't accept that this person is not infallible.

And i can understand letting small things pass like his don't ask don't tell waffling, but when he actually goes above and beyond George W bush and not only imprisons people without trial but wants to assassinate them you really have to ask the question: did the people who complained about these things when Bush did them really mean it? or were they just following along with the trend of being anti-bush, were they principled believers in civil liberties or did they just get angry when Bush took them away but not Obama?

I reckon most people (with a brain) on the left want to protest Obama , but are afraid to be put in the same bag as the teabaggers.

if a guy is holding a bank job and has hostages... swat teams are trained to shoot to kill in these circumstances... I don't know the finer details of this, but this American was basically recruiting killers that would later attempt to hurt innocent people. I don't see the big fuss really, obviously I respect the right to due process, but idk I think the recent news of Bush HOLDING 700+ innocent people in Gitmo cause it would be bad politically to release them is far worse then taking out one of the bad guys

re: boxing day, isn't that almost too perfect then for Obama? that if you criticize him you'll be afraid of being associated with insane righ wingers or racist?

Perfect indeed.

I think we are heading into Alex Jones Dimension.

  On 4/10/2010 at 10:49 PM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

  On 4/10/2010 at 8:13 PM, Awepittance said:

  On 4/10/2010 at 5:42 PM, Boxing Day said:

teabaggers thinking Obama can authorize their assassination is not a good thing.

 

i dont think you've been following, teabaggers and most republicans think that Obama isn't going FAR ENOUGH with his policies against 'terrorism' if anything they are mad at him for not targeting more american citizens who happen to be muslim. Thanks for posting this Kcinsu

 

 

interestingly enough, Rush Limbaugh just today actually criticized Obama for doing this...probably the only thing ive ever agreed with Limbaugh on, though obviously this is purely for partisan attack fodder.

id be interested to hear more context about this. I've heard Rush 'break character' a couple of times recently.

  On 4/11/2010 at 1:16 AM, Awepittance said:

  On 4/10/2010 at 10:49 PM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

  On 4/10/2010 at 8:13 PM, Awepittance said:

  On 4/10/2010 at 5:42 PM, Boxing Day said:

teabaggers thinking Obama can authorize their assassination is not a good thing.

 

i dont think you've been following, teabaggers and most republicans think that Obama isn't going FAR ENOUGH with his policies against 'terrorism' if anything they are mad at him for not targeting more american citizens who happen to be muslim. Thanks for posting this Kcinsu

 

 

interestingly enough, Rush Limbaugh just today actually criticized Obama for doing this...probably the only thing ive ever agreed with Limbaugh on, though obviously this is purely for partisan attack fodder.

 

id be interested to hear more context about this. I've heard Rush 'break character' a couple of times recently.

if i remember correctly, he pretty much just said that we have ordered the sanctioned killing of an american citizen without due process...which IMO, is all that needed to be said. As much as I despise the man, he is right on the button about it.

  On 4/11/2010 at 12:35 AM, Awepittance said:

you're feeding into a manufactured media frenzy. this is how the democrats always get you to vote for them 'the right are scary' , fuck the right ignore them, but instead shows like Rachel Maddow and Olbermann, and Daily show spend 75% of their air time talking about the opposite side? Why give so much air time to your enemey? the whole thing is a fucking joke, ignore the dudes they aren't as powerful as you might think

 

on the other hand, carrying on extremely neoconservative polices under the guise of liberalism/democratic values is much more damaging to this country in the long term (not to mention the damage done to the english language, now socialism = assassinating US citizens?).

the republican party has always used crazy people/extremists/christians to spread their talking points, they dont actually run the republican party. They are total pawns

this 'starting an armed revolution' is not a new right-wing concept, have you heard of the militia movement? It's existed practically since the John Birch society, a 1950s group of republican extremists

 

Edit: basically what im trying to say Boxing Day is that this isn't new, extremists within the republican party have talked about before you and i were born starting an armed revolution in this country to bring it back to the 'good ole' days' , its not going to fucking happen. It's totally disingenuous because these same people didn't seem to mind Bush's push towards big government, its just like being into a football team for most of them. To take them seriously i think is exactly what they want, to the republicans bad press is obviously good press

All I know is whenever any type of civil rights or social justice legislation is put forth the right does everything in its power to stop it. I don't want government telling me what to do either but when you're talking about banks and insurance companies completely ripping people off and basically lying through their teeth about their accounts, a bit of oversight is in order. We can't just have unregulated capitalism, but I'm sure the neocons would love it that way. That way, they can continue doing things like price gouging the oil we get and making record profits off of everyone's misery. Yeah, love that way of thinking. Anything for a buck, that should be our country's motto. Fucking take down the flag and put a dollar bill up, please.

I agree with Obama declaring this guy fit to be dead because he is probably plotting an attack as we speak. If these tea baggers are going to act like minuteman in the revolution, let them take him out. But, apparently this aggression is only acceptable with a Republican in power, so , my fault. We can obliterate third world countries under a guise that they were involved and then say 'mission accomplished', but can't take out one domestic terrorist? I would think he'd be more dangerous than some people across an ocean, 20,000 miles away.

  On 4/11/2010 at 10:42 PM, mafted said:

 

I agree with Obama declaring this guy fit to be dead because he is probably plotting an attack as we speak.

this statement right here is exactly what's disturbing. It's not a good idea to base murdering anyone on a 'probably' or 'the government is probably right about this one'

usually things like this should be based on due process or better yet how about actual proof? This notion of buying what the government tells you without questioning it or asking for proof is very dangerous. This is why the Bush administration was so dangerous, the republicans who followed him would trust 100% the reasoning and logic behind everything he did.

If you proposed some rational reason why his time under Obama you can trust their word (without going through the criminal justice system we have in place) in why they need to kill an american citizen it would be one thing, but if you switch the word Obama with Bush in your statement it becomes an obvious creepy one. Before Obama got in i carried comfortably with me anecdotal evidence that republican/Bush followers were very gullible, very uninformed and very trusting of anyone in a position of authority. At this point its very hard for me to believe that this is an exclusively republican mindset, i fear that it's infected the left and the right equally. and the more i confront Obama supporters with evidence of him doing things worse or exactly the same as Bush that are blatantly neo-conservative foreign policy positions the more i am convinced this is the case. frightening to say the least

im not really going to address the republican stuff you said because well this is a thread about Obama's plans, for some reason any time people try to talk about bad Obama policy we always end up getting distracted by talk about the republican party.

  Quote

ut, apparently this aggression is only acceptable with a Republican in power, so , my fault

clearly any 'going after brown people' mode of aggression is acceptable for any followers of the particular political party in charge at the time.

If the Iraq and Afghanistan wars were both launched under Obama you'd be seeing a lot of liberals rationalizing how we needed to take Saddam down to 'bring peace to the region'. Its partisan team loyalty nothing more

why couldn't they just arrest the guy? because lack of proof?

  On 4/12/2010 at 5:27 AM, Awepittance said:

  On 4/11/2010 at 10:42 PM, mafted said:

 

I agree with Obama declaring this guy fit to be dead because he is probably plotting an attack as we speak.

 

 

 

this statement right here is exactly what's disturbing. It's not a good idea to base murdering anyone on a 'probably' or 'the government is probably right about this one'

usually things like this should be based on due process or better yet how about actual proof? This notion of buying what the government tells you without questioning it or asking for proof is very dangerous. This is why the Bush administration was so dangerous, the republicans who followed him would trust 100% the reasoning and logic behind everything he did.

If you proposed some rational reason why his time under Obama you can trust their word (without going through the criminal justice system we have in place) in why they need to kill an american citizen it would be one thing, but if you switch the word Obama with Bush in your statement it becomes an obvious creepy one. Before Obama got in i carried comfortably with me anecdotal evidence that republican/Bush followers were very gullible, very uninformed and very trusting of anyone in a position of authority. At this point its very hard for me to believe that this is an exclusively republican mindset, i fear that it's infected the left and the right equally. and the more i confront Obama supporters with evidence of him doing things worse or exactly the same as Bush that are blatantly neo-conservative foreign policy positions the more i am convinced this is the case. frightening to say the least

 

im not really going to address the republican stuff you said because well this is a thread about Obama's plans, for some reason any time people try to talk about bad Obama policy we always end up getting distracted by talk about the republican party.

 

  Quote

ut, apparently this aggression is only acceptable with a Republican in power, so , my fault

clearly any 'going after brown people' mode of aggression is acceptable for any followers of the particular political party in charge at the time.

If the Iraq and Afghanistan wars were both launched under Obama you'd be seeing a lot of liberals rationalizing how we needed to take Saddam down to 'bring peace to the region'. Its partisan team loyalty nothing more

fucking christ its nice to have someone around here that thinks the democrats are just as stupid as the repubs

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:32 AM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

  On 4/12/2010 at 5:27 AM, Awepittance said:

  On 4/11/2010 at 10:42 PM, mafted said:

 

I agree with Obama declaring this guy fit to be dead because he is probably plotting an attack as we speak.

 

 

 

this statement right here is exactly what's disturbing. It's not a good idea to base murdering anyone on a 'probably' or 'the government is probably right about this one'

usually things like this should be based on due process or better yet how about actual proof? This notion of buying what the government tells you without questioning it or asking for proof is very dangerous. This is why the Bush administration was so dangerous, the republicans who followed him would trust 100% the reasoning and logic behind everything he did.

If you proposed some rational reason why his time under Obama you can trust their word (without going through the criminal justice system we have in place) in why they need to kill an american citizen it would be one thing, but if you switch the word Obama with Bush in your statement it becomes an obvious creepy one. Before Obama got in i carried comfortably with me anecdotal evidence that republican/Bush followers were very gullible, very uninformed and very trusting of anyone in a position of authority. At this point its very hard for me to believe that this is an exclusively republican mindset, i fear that it's infected the left and the right equally. and the more i confront Obama supporters with evidence of him doing things worse or exactly the same as Bush that are blatantly neo-conservative foreign policy positions the more i am convinced this is the case. frightening to say the least

 

im not really going to address the republican stuff you said because well this is a thread about Obama's plans, for some reason any time people try to talk about bad Obama policy we always end up getting distracted by talk about the republican party.

 

  Quote

ut, apparently this aggression is only acceptable with a Republican in power, so , my fault

clearly any 'going after brown people' mode of aggression is acceptable for any followers of the particular political party in charge at the time.

If the Iraq and Afghanistan wars were both launched under Obama you'd be seeing a lot of liberals rationalizing how we needed to take Saddam down to 'bring peace to the region'. Its partisan team loyalty nothing more

 

 

fucking christ its nice to have someone around here that thinks the democrats are just as stupid as the repubs

really? are you serious?

Lets look at the 90's when Clinton was running things... pretty great

Now lets look at the 00's... hmmm

i cant even tell you how much literature and evidence there is out there about how immensely corrupt the Clinton admin was.

read Free Market Fallacy lectures, lectures on Kosovo, Somalia, and then get back to me.

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:42 AM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

i cant even tell you how much literature and evidence there is out there about how immensely corrupt the Clinton admin was.

 

 

read Free Market Fallacy lectures, lectures on Kosovo, Somalia, and then get back to me.

but just as corrupt as the Bush Administation...?

in all seriousness im just getting tired of having to convince people that neither party even comes close to representing the populous or follow the rules of both domestic and international law....ever. usually shit spewing out about how clinton revolutionized america makes me swell up with anger, but now its just sorta sad.

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:45 AM, karmakramer said:

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:42 AM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

i cant even tell you how much literature and evidence there is out there about how immensely corrupt the Clinton admin was.

 

 

read Free Market Fallacy lectures, lectures on Kosovo, Somalia, and then get back to me.

 

but just as corrupt as the Bush Administation...?

for fucks sake man if you want to make comparisons nothing would ever be done....how is that any different from the tea partiers saying, "obama is increasing the deficit more than bush ever did...therefore the obama admin is far worse"

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:45 AM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

in all seriousness im just getting tired of having to convince people that neither party even comes close to representing the populous or follow the rules of both domestic and international law....ever. usually shit spewing out about how clinton revolutionized america makes me swell up with anger, but now its just sorta sad.

woah who in this thread said dems aren't corrupt?

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:47 AM, karmakramer said:

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:45 AM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

in all seriousness im just getting tired of having to convince people that neither party even comes close to representing the populous or follow the rules of both domestic and international law....ever. usually shit spewing out about how clinton revolutionized america makes me swell up with anger, but now its just sorta sad.

 

woah who in this thread said dems aren't corrupt?

look, believe what you want, but i will say, if you seriously believe Clinton did good for this country or the world, you are sadly nothing but a blockade to progress.

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:46 AM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

in all seriousness im just getting tired of having to convince people that neither party even comes close to representing the populous or follow the rules of both domestic and international law....ever. usually shit spewing out about how clinton revolutionized america makes me swell up with anger, but now its just sorta sad.

 

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:45 AM, karmakramer said:

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:42 AM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

i cant even tell you how much literature and evidence there is out there about how immensely corrupt the Clinton admin was.

 

 

read Free Market Fallacy lectures, lectures on Kosovo, Somalia, and then get back to me.

 

but just as corrupt as the Bush Administation...?

 

 

for fucks sake man if you want to make comparisons nothing would ever be done....how is that any different from the tea partiers saying, "obama is increasing the deficit more than bush ever did...therefore the obama admin is far worse"

you made the comparison by saying republicans and dems are equally corrupt, I am simply disagreeing with you... heres another example, Nixon

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:50 AM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:47 AM, karmakramer said:

  On 4/12/2010 at 6:45 AM, Smettingham Rutherford IV said:

in all seriousness im just getting tired of having to convince people that neither party even comes close to representing the populous or follow the rules of both domestic and international law....ever. usually shit spewing out about how clinton revolutionized america makes me swell up with anger, but now its just sorta sad.

 

woah who in this thread said dems aren't corrupt?

 

 

look, believe what you want, but i will say, if you seriously believe Clinton did good for this country or the world, you are sadly nothing but a blockade to progress.

everyone knows when we vote in november we are voting for the lesser of two evils... I am all for the complete distruction of political parties/labels, cause I think it would re-direct the conversation to "ideas" rather then who's right and wrong...

i remember something in the beginning of this thread about an american citizen under target by the US military without due process. let's get back to that.