any vegans/vegetarians/raw foodists up in da WATTM?

zaphod's other head was just so bad.

  On 6/21/2010 at 8:46 PM, soundwave said:

needs more quotes

  On 6/21/2010 at 1:05 PM, Obel said:

One day I'm going to try being a vegetarian for a month to see how it feels, physically.

 

One thing pisses me off about a lot of vegetarians/vegans *IN MY EXPERIENCE*, and it's popped up in this thread a couple of times. When you ask why they're vegan/vegetarian/whatever, you frequently get rude responses. Proper defensive, like "Why the fuck do you care?". Well, because I'm interested in what peoples motivations are for eating a certain way, the same way I'd innocently ask why somebody listens to a certain type of music... Are people insecure about eating only veg? Is it so wrong to be curious about why of the many reasons there are to change your diet?

 

There are pricks in every walk of life, I know that. I just don't appreciate the rudeness.

 

Speaking of being rude.. even if I were a vegan I'd still fucking despise Troon. That self-righteous fuck.

I'm vegan because I disagree with how the industry is run. Over-milking cows, and keeping chickens in cages so small they can't stand [as well as shit on each other since they're stacked]. Our lifestyle choice tries to limit suffering, and we realize you can't eliminate it completely.

I think a lot of people would be vegetarian if they actually had to go out and catch their food instead of it being packaged in a non-confrontational plastic case in the grocery store.

  On 6/21/2010 at 9:13 PM, Braintree said:

I think a lot of people would be starve to death if they actually had to go out and catch their food instead of it being packaged in a non-confrontational plastic case in the grocery store.

jus sayin

  On 6/21/2010 at 9:10 PM, kaini said:

  On 6/21/2010 at 8:46 PM, soundwave said:

 

needs more quotes

LOL @ quotation marks around sausages. As if meat naturally comes in that shape and has sole use of it.

  On 6/21/2010 at 9:17 PM, theSun said:

  On 6/21/2010 at 9:13 PM, Braintree said:

I think a lot of people would be starve to death if they actually had to go out and catch their food instead of it being packaged in a non-confrontational plastic case in the grocery store.

 

jus sayin

its curious how meat eaters are often more cautious of meat free food than veggies are about meat?

cautious of meat free food? what?

  On 6/21/2010 at 9:35 PM, Braintree said:

  On 6/21/2010 at 9:17 PM, theSun said:

  On 6/21/2010 at 9:13 PM, Braintree said:

I think a lot of people would be starve to death if they actually had to go out and catch their food instead of it being packaged in a non-confrontational plastic case in the grocery store.

 

jus sayin

 

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

not trying to be argumentative, but if humans were still hunter/gatherer, entire cities would die off. of course we wouldn't have built cities like that in the first place if we couldn't feed its inhabitants, but still. the meat-factory system we have feeds a lot of people more efficiently than smaller scale operations. in the long term it will fuck us for sure, but yeah i don't think people would be thinking about ethics as much when you need to eat and animals are food. that's why it took so long for humans to even conceive of such things (ethics).

edit - and why animals don't have time to worry about silly things like ethics

Nothing causes arguments quite like what people choose to put in their bodies.

The meat eaters would probably think different given a situation of being eaten by a bear in the woods - all humans would and if they could keep their lives by not eating meat again, says the moral bear of kindness - I am sure 100% of you would say yes. However, slightly less "intelligent" beings don't have the voice to speak up and we choose to ignore their cries for help. If your not convinced, go watch a bunch of industrial slaughter farm videos on YouTube and the like-there's a reason why the path leading to it is zig-zag, it's because that way the cows aren't able to see the cows in front of them being hung and cut up - they get distressed, panic and shuffle back. What a lovely scene. Let's hope the people who are happy to eat meat aren't cows in the next life time, oh how much they would regret it. 

And before anyone jumps into the whole 'i won't live again!' we don't know for sure so perhaps it is best to take the benefit of the doubt and treat others like you yourself would like to be treated. Consciousness isn't an on/off switch as I'm sure everyone will agree and until we find out if similar animals like us can feel, why not pretend they do unless we cause anymore unnecessary suffering. 

For the ignorants among us who choose to ignore animal cognitive research coming out each new year, you keep your head in the sand when they make ever new discoveries pointing toward similar brain structures, you can't handle reality so we shall all pretend we haven't evolved from the chimpanzee. You join the bat shit-crazy-creationists who choose to ignore scientific proof.

Despite all this, I do believe some of us are more reliant on meat than others, I do think that some people's genes are genuinely adapted to a heavier meat intake than others - just like some chimps were vegetarians. I realise some new research suggests that meat played a part in the development  of our big brain, though potentially who's to say that this was a kind of fuck up on natures part and that having high intelligence can easily fall into having huge developmental progressions which lead to over consumption and the eventual 'tipping point' where it rises to a point of instability and brings what situation we have now - resource strainage.

Thinking about this a bit more, if "high intelligence" was a common and accepted trait, then we would see more of these "high profle" behaviours about in nature (eg the common behaviour to change ones environment with tools on a large scale). But, we don't - we see animals that fit perfect in their environment. Something isn't quite right about that.... Perhaps intelligence is a natural fuck up which leads to extinction. Maybe we are going through natures natural selection and it's pinching our existance out right under our noses.

For research regarding animal brain development and research - have a gander over here:http://www.sciencedaily.com/news/plants_animals/animals/  

  On 6/21/2010 at 8:03 PM, dr lopez said:

why the fuck do we have two of these threads

Because what vegans lack in adipose tissue the make up in self important thoughts.

you wouldn't expect a forum with such a high percentage of athiesm to this level of a dogmatic authoritarian religious edge. environmentalist religion, or vegan religion. I find nothing wrong with believing in this religions but as soon as you start preaching about how are all sinners unless we do ______ is when i find you hard to separate from a priest or cleric.

  Quote

you wouldn't expect a forum with such a high percentage of athiesm to this level of a dogmatic authoritarian religious edge.

why wouldnt you expect that? thats how atheists operate on the internet..

As long as they can come up with a substitute for things like bacon, burgers etc. that has the exact same taste and consistency. I would easily become a vegan.

vaginism

veganism isn't possible on a global level unless the human population scales back dramatically or becomes more centralized. Anyone who thinks it is, or moreso thinks that it is more environmentally friendly is off their rocker. The logistics of moving produce to areas of the world that simply cannot sustain their population on local crops would off put any benefits gained by these populations not eating readily available meat sources. Indians in the arctic and tribal communities in mountainous regions like Mongolia cannot rely on local crops for sustenance, their life depends on meat and animal products.

The meat eaters would probably think different given a situation of being eaten by a bear in the woods - all humans would and if they could keep their lives by not eating meat again, says the moral bear of kindness - I am sure 100% of you would say yes. However, slightly less "intelligent" beings don't have the voice to speak up and we choose to ignore their cries for help. If your not convinced, go watch a bunch of industrial slaughter farm videos on youtube and the like-there's a reason why the path leading to it is zig-zag, it's because that way the cows aren't able to see the cows in front of them being hung and cut up - they get distressed, panic and shuffle back. What a lovely scene. Let's hope the people who are happy to eat meat aren't cows in the next life time, oh how much they would regret it.

And before anyone jumps into the whole 'i won't live again!' we don't know for sure so perhaps it is best to take the benefit of the doubt and treat others like you yourself would like to be treated. Consciousness isn't an on/off switch as I'm sure everyone will agree and until we find out if similar animals like us can feel, why not pretend they do unless we cause any more unnecessary suffering.

For the ignorants among us who choose to ignore animal cognitive research coming out each new year, you keep your head in the sand when they make ever new discoveries pointing toward similar brain structures, you can't handle reality so we shall all pretend we haven't evolved from the chimpanzee. You join the bat shit-crazy-creationists who choose to ignore scientific proof.

Despite all this, I do believe some of us are more reliant on meat than others, I do think that some people's genes are genuinely adapted to a heavier meat intake than others - just like some chimps were vegetarians. I realise some new research suggests that meat played a part in the development of our big brain, though potentially who's to say that this was a kind of fuck up on natures part and that having high intelligence can easily fall into having huge developmental progressions which lead to over consumption and the eventual 'tipping point' where it rises to a point of instability and brings what situation we have now - resource strainage.

Thinking about this a bit more, if "high intelligence" was a common and accepted trait, then we would see more of these "high profile" behaviours about in nature (eg the common behaviour to change ones environment with tools on a large scale). But, we don't - we see animals that fit perfect in their environment. Something isn't quite right about that.... Perhaps intelligence is a natural fuck up which leads to extinction. Maybe we are going through natures natural selection and it's pinching our existence out right under our noses.

For research regarding animal brain development and research - have a gander over here: http://www.sciencedaily.com/news/plants_animals/animals/

lol

lol

smart people tend not to breed which means humanity is selectively breeding out its intelligence in favor of stupidity. in a few centuries the world will look like a post-apocalyptic jodorowsky film and we will all run around hitting each other with clubs

(i'm joking.. i think)

people get stuck in their ways very quickly don't like to be proven wrong if they don't see(or fail to see) the bad points and like sheep think it can't be wrong if everyone else is still cueing up at the Macdonalds drive thru so they can get back in time for Animal Hospital

  On 6/21/2010 at 11:56 PM, TwiddleBot said:

smart people tend not to breed which means humanity is selectively breeding out its intelligence in favor of stupidity. in a few centuries the world will look like a post-apocalyptic jodorowsky film and we will all run around hitting each other with clubs

 

(i'm joking.. i think)

midgets and amputees everywhere? frogs and blood?

also, reading this thread... man i bet a watmm party would be utterly dreadful.

Braintree, you look really skinny these days. Like, erm, TOO skinny.

cows are probably begging to be slaughtered. no fucking tv, no fucking xbox, no fucking internet, just standing around watching grass grow all day. it's got to get old after a while. look how bored they look. they're happyish when they are younger, but then the big ones are just eyes half-closed like "fuck this." they were probably only meant to survive a year or so in the wild cause they are so bored. it's inhumane not to kill and eat them. they are probably glad when they die. i bet they have pretty immense feelings of self-fulfillment when they get slaughtered. "i was a good cow. i did everything i could've done as a cow. flawless textbook cow victory. ate some grass, got milked, made some more cows. bam."

on the other hand i visited some goats in buena vista, colorado last week. bunch of baby goats running around, jumping off shit. cutest thing ever. they seemed to be pretty down with being goats. i could watch baby goats run around for an eternity. then i had some goat cheese. thanks, goats.