any vegans/vegetarians/raw foodists up in da WATTM?

ITT: Moral objectivity on par with what one would see on 700 club or the glenn beck pall mall cigarettes variety hour.

  On 6/22/2010 at 2:13 AM, vamos scorcho said:

yeah, so we should assume that they don't think at all like us and slaughter them by the trillions

is that what i said? even a little bit?

"not saying i support the slaughter of animals in this fashion (i don't, really)"

NO. i'm on your fucking team, but i think holding an argument will get us no where because we can't prove it either way!? to find it wrong on a "moral" basis (which i, personally, do, twat) means nothing. its a projection, one of my beliefs and expectations onto other "good" people. THINK.

Vamos, didn't you say you were NOT a vegetarian yourself? Also, do you not eat fast food?

I have the most superior morals, bow to me.

You drink coffee though right Dan C? Caffeine is a potent psychoactive drug, despite its legality.

I only drink water, and that has to be rain water I collected myself.

Circle of life man.

TRU DAT!

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"mass slaughter of any animal is wrong, vegetarianism/veganism is CLEARLY morally superior - fact"

In the supermarket I hunt broccoli with a compound bow. It's only fair.

  On 6/22/2010 at 2:59 AM, lumpenprol said:

In the supermarket I hunt broccoli with a compound bow. It's only fair.

hahaha, I can imagine tiny old chinese men over there with headbands on and shields, ready to jump out and protect their produce.

  On 6/21/2010 at 8:01 PM, doorjamb said:

 

even so, though, even if plants don't feel pain, don't they still have just as much right to life as animals and humans? does the lack of a nervous system really make them "sub-human," or just "non-human"?

 

"oh but they're different from me so it's okay to murder and eat them."

 

if scientists were to create a new breed of cow that had no nervous system, just a numb bag of meat on legs, would you be okay with "farming" them and killing them in slaughterhouses by the thousands?

 

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(I'm partly just trolling but I also find these to be interesting questions)

 

Heh... I don't think your comments/questions are entirely unreasonable....

Ok so... yes plants are alive, and to an extent, I agree they have a right to life, obviously things like deforestation is bad. However, I think a lack of a nervous system is a legitimate reason not to feel any guilt for killing it. It's not that I think "they're different to me" or "they're a lower life form" it's more a matter of "logically speaking, it makes no sense to feel bad about killing something that isn't sentient". A plant is as bothered about being destroyed as a rock or a glass of water (as far as I know. My knowledge on this stuff is limited to be honest...). I think this is the reason why most people don't think much of killing a plant but it takes a lot more guts to kill an animal (again... as far as I know... most people I know would struggle to kill an animal even if they eat meat). And the same goes for things like insects... they have far less sophisticated "brains" than other forms of life, and so most people don't feel bad about killing them (I do a bit though personally, I try not to).

So that said, yeah I would eat a lab created lump of meat.

@ Dan : Am wowed by the rainwater but sausages are older than old. So much culture and design like a gold watch.

Some animals do seemed designed for eating. Step on a spruce-hen's wings and yank its neck to flay beautifully. Toss on grill. Tomatoes are a gift.

Suck my Glamorgan sausage whelp!

Yes yes, everyone listen to troon and please turn vegan so I can get all the baby back ribs, sirloin steaks, rib eye steaks, pork tenderloins soaked in worchestershire sauce, kobe beef, honey baked hams, and filet mignons cheap as fuck.

  On 6/21/2010 at 9:44 PM, theSun said:

  On 6/21/2010 at 9:35 PM, Braintree said:

  On 6/21/2010 at 9:17 PM, theSun said:

  On 6/21/2010 at 9:13 PM, Braintree said:

I think a lot of people would be starve to death if they actually had to go out and catch their food instead of it being packaged in a non-confrontational plastic case in the grocery store.

 

jus sayin

 

 

 

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not trying to be argumentative, but if humans were still hunter/gatherer, entire cities would die off. of course we wouldn't have built cities like that in the first place if we couldn't feed its inhabitants, but still. the meat-factory system we have feeds a lot of people more efficiently than smaller scale operations. in the long term it will fuck us for sure, but yeah i don't think people would be thinking about ethics as much when you need to eat and animals are food. that's why it took so long for humans to even conceive of such things (ethics).

 

edit - and why animals don't have time to worry about silly things like ethics

Good point, it would also take care of that overpopulation thing we got going on.

  On 6/22/2010 at 1:39 AM, 24ourange said:

  On 6/22/2010 at 1:04 AM, sneaksta303 said:

Braintree, you look really skinny these days. Like, erm, TOO skinny.

 

no ass, i'll pass.

The ladies don't tend to mind.

*backflips into thread*

We should really limit these types of threads to one at a time.

*somersaults out of thread*

What's wrong with raising chickens for eggs and milkin cows in small scale? And some vegans are against eating honey? What the fuck?

i struggle with my love for animals and my love for food. the compromise thus far has been to join the local foods movement. denver has loads of amazing restaurants and farmers markets that use seasonable sustainable local foods and it's a safer bet that the ingredients are quality and that the animals are treated humanely. also i only get eggs from chickens that i've personally met. they really are 6 of the dumbest as fuck chickens i've ever seen though, and they are pretty mean to each other, but still, hilarious, and you cant begrudge an animal for just wanted to kick dirt around all day. i think farmers are a bit more real as far as personifying animals. people with little everyday contact with food animals probably dont realize what a bunch of pricks some of these animals are. personifying just shouldnt be done. we see these animals as "innocent" but innocense seems a bit irrelevant. i'm guilty of this too, but realy, what are they innocent of? when i visited those goats it was extremely cute and it pulled on my heartstrings, but really they were just coming up to me hoping i would give them food. we dont want to treat these animals like we would want to be treated and dress them up in goat, chicken and pig jeans and go have a few beers with them. i think making sure we are allowing the animal to have a degree of free will to run around and do decidedly animal things should be the focus. an animal should be allowed to be healthy and "happy" in the sense that it can live a somewhat simulated life compared to its wild counterparts. local farms in general provide such an environment.

farm people think nothing of killing animals. They have a whole diff outlook. A girl I know was raised on a farm and she had her dog put down cause he was too clingy. She said it like it was nothing

  On 6/22/2010 at 7:28 AM, Fred McGriff said:

i struggle with my love for animals and my love for food. the compromise thus far has been to join the local foods movement. denver has loads of amazing restaurants and farmers markets that use seasonable sustainable local foods and it's a safer bet that the ingredients are quality and that the animals are treated humanely. also i only get eggs from chickens that i've personally met. they really are 6 of the dumbest as fuck chickens i've ever seen though, and they are pretty mean to each other, but still, hilarious, and you cant begrudge an animal for just wanted to kick dirt around all day. i think farmers are a bit more real as far as personifying animals. people with little everyday contact with food animals probably dont realize what a bunch of pricks some of these animals are. personifying just shouldnt be done. we see these animals as "innocent" but innocense seems a bit irrelevant. i'm guilty of this too, but realy, what are they innocent of? when i visited those goats it was extremely cute and it pulled on my heartstrings, but really they were just coming up to me hoping i would give them food. we dont want to treat these animals like we would want to be treated and dress them up in goat, chicken and pig jeans and go have a few beers with them. i think making sure we are allowing the animal to have a degree of free will to run around and do decidedly animal things should be the focus. an animal should be allowed to be healthy and "happy" in the sense that it can live a somewhat simulated life compared to its wild counterparts. local farms in general provide such an environment.

I like this kind of idea too, I hope I can do more of this kind of thing eventually too. So far my vegetarianism has been very lazy and flexible. But I aim to one day grow a lot of my own food and buy local produce and stuff.

And yes farm animals can be really cruel to each other. That vegetarian friend of mine I mentioned grew up on a farm (funnily enough he didn't become vegetarian till after he left home) and he told me about how adult pigs have to be kept seperate from the piglets because they'll eat their own young. And chickens can be pretty vicious too.

  On 6/22/2010 at 7:39 AM, marf said:

farm people think nothing of killing animals. They have a whole diff outlook. A girl I know was raised on a farm and she had her dog put down cause he was too clingy. She said it like it was nothing

You should have poisened her mother because she mildly irritated you, just drop it in at a casual dinner party a couple weeks later.

Can a vegetarian here give me an example of their eating "plan" for one day, please? I'd be interested to know what your meals are like over the course of a day.

hey guys, florida stone crabs get one claw/leg torn off and then they are hurled back in to the ocean. since they can regrow their claws, they can be harvested again and again. sometimes the crabs have both legs torn off and they have to eat sea grass.

just the right amount of cruelty to make me salivate.