Sony Expected To Unveil The Next Playstation Tomorrow

  On 2/21/2013 at 9:54 PM, eugene said:

doubt that even current high-end gfx cards could output 4k (which is roughly x4 pixels than the 1080p) with modern games, chances are that ps4 is sporting something analogous to hd7870.

ps3 came out in late 2006 and has something akin to 7800gtx, when 8800s were already out by that time.

you're right, they can't really push games at decent speeds.

but my current graphics card (GTX 560) can be used to game at 2560x1600, and the current generation of high end cards can handle 7680x1600 (3x 2560x1600 monitors in eyefinity setup).

But realistically, it makes sense to have a console restricted to 1080p since no-one playing at home is gonna be using a 4K television for quite some time.

  On 2/21/2013 at 10:14 PM, oscillik said:

 

  On 2/21/2013 at 9:54 PM, eugene said:

doubt that even current high-end gfx cards could output 4k (which is roughly x4 pixels than the 1080p) with modern games, chances are that ps4 is sporting something analogous to hd7870.

ps3 came out in late 2006 and has something akin to 7800gtx, when 8800s were already out by that time.

you're right, they can't really push games at decent speeds.

 

but my current graphics card (GTX 560) can be used to game at 2560x1600, and the current generation of high end cards can handle 7680x1600 (3x 2560x1600 monitors in eyefinity setup).

 

But realistically, it makes sense to have a console restricted to 1080p since no-one playing at home is gonna be using a 4K television for quite some time.

I agree - there's simply no need when there's nary any 4K content, let alone the percentage of 4K set owners is probably well under 1% right now. Even the vast majority of PC monitors these days only do 1080P resolution, despite most graphics cards being capable of much more.

I'd rather have 1080P/60FPS games than 4K @ 30FPS. It will be curious when we get to see the first real batch of PS4 games (and the next XBOX) what spec they really run at - I hope they all can achieve the 1080P/60 spec as 1080P/30 would be disappointing, although I fear that will be the norm just like 720P/30 is these days for most PS3/360 games.

Those screenshots from Killzone 4 I posted are 2048x1152... odd resolution if they weren't cropped beforehand.

I feel like thatgamecompany should've had a presentation. Journey pushed the PS3 to the max. Interested to hear their thoughts on what the PS4 can do, and also what's next for them.

  On 2/21/2013 at 10:46 PM, Tauhid said:

I feel like thatgamecompany should've had a presentation. Journey pushed the PS3 to the max. Interested to hear their thoughts on what the PS4 can do, and also what's next for them.

Jenova Chen and the gang are moving onto other things... I think they're going multiplatform for their next release, and Jenova has said it will be really hard to top Journey, so they're doing a lot of thinking about their next game.

I'm really interested to see what Dylan Cuthbert and Q-Games comes up with - I'd love a Pixeljunk Monsters HD MAX or something insane like that from them.

Journey pushed the PS3 to the max? Come on.

In what way?

  On 2/21/2013 at 10:20 PM, Joyrex said:

 

  On 2/21/2013 at 10:14 PM, oscillik said:

 

  On 2/21/2013 at 9:54 PM, eugene said:

doubt that even current high-end gfx cards could output 4k (which is roughly x4 pixels than the 1080p) with modern games, chances are that ps4 is sporting something analogous to hd7870.

ps3 came out in late 2006 and has something akin to 7800gtx, when 8800s were already out by that time.

you're right, they can't really push games at decent speeds.

 

but my current graphics card (GTX 560) can be used to game at 2560x1600, and the current generation of high end cards can handle 7680x1600 (3x 2560x1600 monitors in eyefinity setup).

 

But realistically, it makes sense to have a console restricted to 1080p since no-one playing at home is gonna be using a 4K television for quite some time.

I agree - there's simply no need when there's nary any 4K content, let alone the percentage of 4K set owners is probably well under 1% right now. Even the vast majority of PC monitors these days only do 1080P resolution, despite most graphics cards being capable of much more.

 

I'd rather have 1080P/60FPS games than 4K @ 30FPS. It will be curious when we get to see the first real batch of PS4 games (and the next XBOX) what spec they really run at - I hope they all can achieve the 1080P/60 spec as 1080P/30 would be disappointing, although I fear that will be the norm just like 720P/30 is these days for most PS3/360 games.

60fps means you have literally half as much processing time per frame. If you are really taking advantage of the hardware, that means the game has the potential to look substantially better if you target 30fps. I would rather have a substantially better looking game running at 30fps than a lesser one running at 60fps.

  On 2/21/2013 at 10:46 PM, Tauhid said:

I feel like thatgamecompany should've had a presentation. Journey pushed the PS3 to the max.

From a technical or hardware usage perspective... absolutely not.

Please tell me no one is gonna fall for prerendered "gameplay" footage again, Killzone burned us before, and Gearbox was just busted for the same.

There's a forum post by one of the devs that gets into the physics of the game and how they were limited by the PS3's tech, unless I read it wrong.

http://www.thatgamecompany.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=11191

I also remember reading a statement from Jenova or someone else about how they tried to incorporate a screenshot feature, but they couldn't fit it in or something like that.

They couldn't fit it inside the PS3? The download of the game?

  On 2/21/2013 at 11:12 PM, cult fiction said:

 

  On 2/21/2013 at 10:46 PM, Tauhid said:

I feel like thatgamecompany should've had a presentation. Journey pushed the PS3 to the max.

From a technical or hardware usage perspective... absolutely not.

the Uncharted series is the PS3 flagship imho closely followed by GOW3, Wipeout HD and MGS4

http://www.thatgamecompany.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2001

"There isn't a screenshot function in the game.

It would be awesome, but it would probably cause the game to freeze for a couple seconds while it's taking the screenshot and saving, which could also mess with the online aspect and possibly overflow the PS3's RAM and processing power."

I think Journey makes heavy use of the SPE's to do some of the sand deformations. A lot of it is obviously happening in shader code but the geometry deformation is pretty damn cool. Flower showed us some of that mass parallelization as well by making very large amounts of seemingly individual grass blades respond to wind. It might not push the GPU to the limit, but both games made use of the unique Cell processor architecture in an interesting way. I doubt those games could be accomplished on X360 hardware and porting it to a PC architecture would require significant work.

It's pretty exciting to see things like compute shaders and an up-to-date shader feature set go into the mainstream. The flexibility and "simplicity" of the PS4's architecture will be a godsend for everyone.

  On 2/22/2013 at 1:01 AM, Tauhid said:

There's a forum post by one of the devs that gets into the physics of the game and how they were limited by the PS3's tech, unless I read it wrong.

 

http://www.thatgamecompany.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=11191

 

I also remember reading a statement from Jenova or someone else about how they tried to incorporate a screenshot feature, but they couldn't fit it in or something like that.

Every game that has ever existed has been constrained by the hardware it's running on. They've also been constrained by the amount of engineering/art time available to optimize. Just because Journey was "limited" by the PS3 hardware doesn't mean that it's the game that most took advantage of the PS3 hardware. What the Journey developer's description amounted to was: we initially tried to do something totally unrealistic with the sand, and wound up having to lod it and simplify the problem. Welcome to game development. Large retail games like Uncharted, Just Cause 2, Dark Souls, GTAIV, etc. deal with these problems in hundreds of complex systems and have to make compromises the same way.

From what I understand (and I could be totally off-base), but he's just referring to a spike in processing. Not an overall usage.

There's definitely a work-around for it, but they didn't want to put the time in. At least that's what it sounds like.

  On 2/22/2013 at 1:13 AM, soundwave said:

 

  On 2/21/2013 at 11:12 PM, cult fiction said:

 

  On 2/21/2013 at 10:46 PM, Tauhid said:

I feel like thatgamecompany should've had a presentation. Journey pushed the PS3 to the max.

From a technical or hardware usage perspective... absolutely not.

the Uncharted series is the PS3 flagship imho closely followed by GOW3, Wipeout HD and MGS4

you forgot Killzone. From a tech perspective, that's the most challenging (though I don't like Guerrilla)

@ID_AA_Carmack: I can’t speak freely about PS4, but now that some specs have been made public, I can say that Sony made wise engineering choices.



Tiago Sousa ‏@CRYTEK_TIAGO
R&D Principal Graphics Programmer at Crytek. Worked on Far Cry, Crysis 1, 2 and 3 + all CryENGINE iterations.

8 GB unified mem as baseline for next tech iterations makes me very, very happy. Fun times coming ^_^

I would've thought that not having instant backwards compatibility would put a lot of current users off getting a new system, for a while anyhow. When there's still solid production of new games for the PS3 why would a heavy user fork out for the new one straight away if they lose all the games they have and, if it's not transferable, the trophys?

  On 2/22/2013 at 9:46 AM, compson said:

@ID_AA_Carmack: I can’t speak freely about PS4, but now that some specs have been made public, I can say that Sony made wise engineering choices.

 

 

Oscillik's a game dev now?

being out of the videogame loop for a long time, the question on my mind is haven't we reached some sort of threshold in terms of making graphics more impressive running on consumer based equipment? Going from Ps1 to Ps2 (and the other consoles that had a similar jump) was the last time i was truly impressed by the leap in graphics technology, the Ps2 to Ps3 was impressive too but slightly less so. Will there even be a noticeable leap forward this time around?

to me this is a pretty significant jump because there seems to be a level of lushness to the clarity and aliasing of the image that allows the eyes to not be distracted like they have been since the dawn of 3D games. 2D in many ways still has quite a lot of visual appeal because its simplicity suits it.

is there any actual video or screenshots of these new games in action? That gif looks cool but it looks like its 256 colors and 10fps

This PS4 thing does sound pretty good. Maybe I'll finally make the switch from Xbox to Playstation.

Playstation 4 won't be blocking used games (at least according to quite a few sources) while the next Xbox, according to many sources, probably will. If that's the case, PS4 will be the clear winner.

Yeah, if they're blocking used games I know exactly where my money will end up. So far what I've read about the PS4 reveal it doesn't sound as cluster fucky as I expect.

I only care about games though. Social shit can get fucked, I don't need that integration. If a console has the games I want to play, I'll be there. Eventually.