quantizing

i think you should start quantizing.

rip beneboi

  Awepittance said:

rip beneboi

ugh, why did you bump this thread? Talk about a frustrating read!

  Tamas said:

I usually waste a ton of time to quantize things by hand...

 

Well, it's not really a waste, I don't think. A lot of the time if I use automatic quantization the song loses the rhythm that I wanted for it, so I just work by hand. Plus, I think doing it that way can teach you more about sequencing drum loops and such, because you notice what types of rhythms and hits sound good for whatever sound you're going for.

Yeah, same here, quantization never really works out for me. Quantizing everything by hand is a pretty tedious chore though, dragging every note in the piano roll with my mouse to the right place...

  Velazquez said:

that's what Mom always said ^

10 months later this^ is the best post in the thread.

ooh i dont use quantising

ooh burial loops his beats

ooh soundforge

grow up

*quantizes penis*

In before thread quantize.

Also, one thing that no-one in this thread mentions (probably because it just confuses the debate even further) is quantizing to the live groove of recording/sample. While it may not be 'natural' as such to quantize a drum machine to the placement of individual hits (and velocities, panning, etc) of a live drummer, you can't exactly criticize such a process on account of it being rhythmically static and mechanical sounding.

  Betty said:

Also, one thing that no-one in this thread mentions (probably because it just confuses the debate even further) is quantizing to the live groove of recording/sample. While it may not be 'natural' as such to quantize a drum machine to the placement of individual hits (and velocities, panning, etc) of a live drummer, you can't exactly criticize such a process on account of it being rhythmically static and mechanical sounding.

What can do this?  Like, which program?

  OneToThirtySix said:

  Betty said:

Also, one thing that no-one in this thread mentions (probably because it just confuses the debate even further) is quantizing to the live groove of recording/sample. While it may not be 'natural' as such to quantize a drum machine to the placement of individual hits (and velocities, panning, etc) of a live drummer, you can't exactly criticize such a process on account of it being rhythmically static and mechanical sounding.

 

What can do this?  Like, which program?

most host sequencers that have been around for a while can like Cubase, Nuendo, Digital Performer, Logic and a couple others i can't think of. However for me personally the concept sounds much better than it actually works. But maybe my source material was too difficult for cubase to handle (i remember once trying a zakir hussain tabla beat)

they are usually referred to as 'groove quantize' or just 'grooves'

  Awepittance said:

most host sequencers that have been around for a while can like Cubase, Nuendo, Digital Performer, Logic and a couple others i can't think of. However for me personally the concept sounds much better than it actually works. But maybe my source material was too difficult for cubase to handle (i remember once trying a zakir hussain tabla beat)

they are usually referred to as 'groove quantize' or just 'grooves'

Oh, so that's what Reason means by "user groove" . . . time to open the handbook again . . . 

  OneToThirtySix said:

  Awepittance said:

most host sequencers that have been around for a while can like Cubase, Nuendo, Digital Performer, Logic and a couple others i can't think of. However for me personally the concept sounds much better than it actually works. But maybe my source material was too difficult for cubase to handle (i remember once trying a zakir hussain tabla beat)

they are usually referred to as 'groove quantize' or just 'grooves'

 

Oh, so that's what Reason means by "user groove" . . . time to open the handbook again . . .

yeah, Reason's works, but i never really use it. I mean I quantize, just not the "user groove" stuff.

  sneaksta303 said:

  OneToThirtySix said:

  Awepittance said:

most host sequencers that have been around for a while can like Cubase, Nuendo, Digital Performer, Logic and a couple others i can't think of. However for me personally the concept sounds much better than it actually works. But maybe my source material was too difficult for cubase to handle (i remember once trying a zakir hussain tabla beat)

they are usually referred to as 'groove quantize' or just 'grooves'

 

Oh, so that's what Reason means by "user groove" . . . time to open the handbook again . . .

 

yeah, Reason's works, but i never really use it. I mean I quantize, just not the "user groove" stuff.

aye, me too. that's the one feature of reason 4 i havent really bothered with yet. i only open the "groove mixer" to adjust the master shuffle, but maybe i should be trying to figure it out. don't have time for it at the moment.

i'm not a good enough keyboardist to want to keep my own, er, groove on most occasions. i do usually keep velocities and note durations, just move the start point around. i use quantize but not all at once. piano roll/grid edit, i'll select a block of 4 or 8 or something and press Q, they quantize, if any are incorrect i fix them. this way i don't have to move every note, but it doesn't wreck my shit like if i just quantized it all at once.

not really much for weird custom quantization, but it seems cool and i'll get to it someday.

i usually stick to the grid for MIDI, but with audio i just drag shit all over.

  Awepittance said:

  OneToThirtySix said:

  Betty said:

Also, one thing that no-one in this thread mentions (probably because it just confuses the debate even further) is quantizing to the live groove of recording/sample. While it may not be 'natural' as such to quantize a drum machine to the placement of individual hits (and velocities, panning, etc) of a live drummer, you can't exactly criticize such a process on account of it being rhythmically static and mechanical sounding.

 

What can do this?  Like, which program?

 

most host sequencers that have been around for a while can like Cubase, Nuendo, Digital Performer, Logic and a couple others i can't think of. However for me personally the concept sounds much better than it actually works. But maybe my source material was too difficult for cubase to handle (i remember once trying a zakir hussain tabla beat)

they are usually referred to as 'groove quantize' or just 'grooves'

wow, i never knew this was even possible. does it try to figure it out automatically or do you have to tap the beat? this would be stupidly useful for me because i have several live improvisations recorded by my band that i want to re-record/add to, but keep the exact same structure and timing, rather than starting with a blank slate and spending a year on drum patterns, lol.

Can someone explain groove templates? For instance, I recently came across MPC 60 groove templates, downloaded them without knowing what the f they are, how do they work? in a sequencer?

  modey said:

  Awepittance said:

  OneToThirtySix said:

  Betty said:

Also, one thing that no-one in this thread mentions (probably because it just confuses the debate even further) is quantizing to the live groove of recording/sample. While it may not be 'natural' as such to quantize a drum machine to the placement of individual hits (and velocities, panning, etc) of a live drummer, you can't exactly criticize such a process on account of it being rhythmically static and mechanical sounding.

 

What can do this? Like, which program?

 

most host sequencers that have been around for a while can like Cubase, Nuendo, Digital Performer, Logic and a couple others i can't think of. However for me personally the concept sounds much better than it actually works. But maybe my source material was too difficult for cubase to handle (i remember once trying a zakir hussain tabla beat)

they are usually referred to as 'groove quantize' or just 'grooves'

wow, i never knew this was even possible. does it try to figure it out automatically or do you have to tap the beat? this would be stupidly useful for me because i have several live improvisations recorded by my band that i want to re-record/add to, but keep the exact same structure and timing, rather than starting with a blank slate and spending a year on drum patterns, lol.

there's been talk on these forums before of creating a custom groove synced with trees blowing in the wind and shit. search it

That's completely the wrong definition of "groove quantize"

Originally, groove quantize just meant "quantize but add small bits of random out of time ness", or "move the notes closer to the beats but not necessarily all the way"

More recently, you can have a template for which beat in the bar gets shifted by how much - the templates being called "grooves"

Groove quantize does NOT mean "magically detect the groove of this audio and quantize my midi to it". I'm not saying there arent tools that do this, but they arent sitting under "groove quantize" in your regular DAW menu

  Velazquez said:

Can someone explain groove templates? For instance, I recently came across MPC 60 groove templates, downloaded them without knowing what the f they are, how do they work? in a sequencer?

I used to use these in Cubase. Now I use these all the time in FL. They're based off the well known timing of the swing of the MPC-60 sequencer. The templates I have range from 50% to 70% swing or something. You can apply them on 16th notes, for example, with 50% adding hardly noticeable swing, to 70% which you'll hear a more obvious swing.

I find it's best to use different amounts of swing on different drum parts or midi parts - for instance hi hats having 60%, snares at 50%, kicks at 70% etc. - it really loosens up everything.

In FL you can create these templates from any midi file. The midi files can be made from drum breaks or any audio in the beatslicer, then saved as a groove template. In Cubase I think the swing as well as the velocities can be part of the groove template - but not so in FL, or at least I don't know how to do that.

I always liked the feel of my TR-707, so I recorded some audio of the hihats, sliced the audio file in the beatslicer, then saved the midi part as a groove template. Sometimes I use it when I want that old drum machine feel on some hi-hats or whatever. Even my synth parts. Between my not so great keyboard skills and my computer's latency, these templates are really useful.

i quantize everything because im a perfectionist and it usually the way i feel it's meant to sound

but chords sound better unquantized

  analogue wings said:

That's completely the wrong definition of "groove quantize"

 

Originally, groove quantize just meant "quantize but add small bits of random out of time ness", or "move the notes closer to the beats but not necessarily all the way"

 

More recently, you can have a template for which beat in the bar gets shifted by how much - the templates being called "grooves"

 

Groove quantize does NOT mean "magically detect the groove of this audio and quantize my midi to it". I'm not saying there arent tools that do this, but they arent sitting under "groove quantize" in your regular DAW menu

But you could create (by create I mean setting the parameters for the imperfections of the groove manually) a "user groove" based on a slightly-out-of-time rhythm pattern, right?

In Ableton 8 you can actually extract grooves from anything, add them to your groove library, then apply them to other clips with control over things like time stretching/velocity/randomness.

Its kinda interesting to see what kinda wonky fx you get if you extract a groove from field recording and then apply it to a drum loop with full timing quantization enabled.