People who hang out here all the time, don't produce, and treat the forum like a public toilet

  On 9/19/2013 at 1:49 PM, impakt said:

 

Basically I'm on watmm for

the rush, the adaptation, and the general backwardness of the act

 

i still don't get this reference

  On 9/26/2013 at 4:55 AM, LimpyLoo said:

 

  On 9/19/2013 at 1:49 PM, impakt said:

 

Basically I'm on watmm for

the rush, the adaptation, and the general backwardness of the act

 

 

i still don't get this reference

 

somebody on here said that. it was his reason for cutting.

  On 9/18/2013 at 1:05 PM, wabby said:

 

  On 9/17/2013 at 7:57 PM, LimpyLoo said:

 

  On 9/17/2013 at 7:51 PM, Braintree said:

I don't really post in EKT much anymore because I got tired of arguing with audio neophytes about production techniques.

 

"You should use a compressor to compress."

"NUHH UHHHHH!!!!!#$%TYGFSRDH"

 

I just check it out for new synth demos and stuff now.

I'm gonna try to start contributing half-decent information to EKT again.

 

 

 

That is, if anyone is interested in my thoughts on music-making...?

Yes please! :)

 

I've been thinking about how you strongly recommend studying bebop, I'd like to hear more details from you about this especially in regards to what you described as 'chromaticism'. I haven't studied jazz in any formal way but I'm really interested in how (and this is just my own made-up way of understanding it) you can look at movements with a key with a very short term memory i.e. the last 3 notes or so, rather than being fixed, and from there extrapolate out into different scalar directions depending on what has or hasn't been indicated.

 

I don't understand this. Can you give an example or be more concrete, maybe?

but anyway,

Chromaticism is all about passing from target-note to target-note

(the target notes are often chord-tones)

using chromatic fragments

so an example of bebop fragments over Cmaj7

would be like B-Bb-A-Ab-G

or D-Db-C-D-B-A-Ab-F#-G-E

an important concept in all this is Harmonic Rhythm

whereby strong notes (mostly) land on strong beats (aka downbeats)

and weak notes (mostly) land on weak beats (aka upbeats)

when a melody sounds or feels somehow off

it often has to do with Harmonic Rhythm

anyway...

  On 9/26/2013 at 5:18 AM, LimpyLoo said:

 

I don't understand this. Can you give an example or be more concrete, maybe?

 

 

but anyway,

Chromaticism is all about passing from target-note to target-note

(the target notes are often chord-tones)

using chromatic fragments

 

so an example of bebop fragments over Cmaj7

 

would be like B-Bb-A-Ab-G

or D-Db-C-D-B-A-Ab-F#-G-E

 

an important concept in all this is Harmonic Rhythm

whereby strong notes (mostly) land on strong beats (aka downbeats)

and weak notes (mostly) land on weak beats (aka upbeats)

 

when a melody sounds or feels somehow off

it often has to do with Harmonic Rhythm

 

anyway...

Hmm, the way harmonic rhythm influences melody is something worth looking into, thanks for that.

When I was referring to memory, there might be a better way to talk about it. But for example, in regard to the Cmaj7 there are only 4 four notes that are chord tones, the other intervals used to form a scale, the 2nd, 4th and 6th are indeterminate. Those intervals would have an importance somewhere in between strong and weak notes, so might sometimes be used on a down beat otherwise the options would become too limited. The Cmaj7 chord is unlikely to appear in isolation within a composition, so the 2nd, 4th and 6th degrees used will often be consistent with the tones from chords that come before the Cmaj7. This makes for smoother modal transitions, but if you're always being consistent with a series of previous chords then it gets limiting and predictable as well. That's why I refer to a kind of 'short-term-memory'.

Also, this might be a separate issue but think about moving in an simple interval pattern that goes down a 5th then up a major 4th and repeat. This uses major triadic intervals rather than semi-tones but in a way, isn't it a kind of chromaticism too? Since if you continue you'll very quickly hit all 12 notes? This is like the most extreme form of 'short-term-memory' where you could think of a root note constantly shifting.

So chromaticism might simply mean 'passing notes' for moving about in an improvisational way, but doesn't it have all sorts of other effects while you do this? Any short series of notes is a series of intervals that could be thought of in various scalar relationships and every note briefly forms a chord with what ever else is going on!

So! I'm not sure if I have question about all this lol.. I mainly wanted to say, yes, more of this talk in ETK would be great. I want to learn the terminology for discussing these subversive interval tricks as I've begun to discover they are the main thing that makes for interesting harmonies and melodies, to my ears anyway.

  On 9/27/2013 at 3:38 AM, wabby said:

Also, this might be a separate issue but think about moving in an simple interval pattern that goes down a 5th then up a major 4th and repeat.

earlier today, i tried to solicit someone for a wank in a cubicle in the boc subforum, but they just started asking me about the significance of the number 4 in the BoC mythology. ffs joyrex, either bite the pillow and make this place a gay hookup spot, or else leave it as it is, a collection of lonely nerds.

that's how boc fans reject people. i saw a girl with dreads and pit hair dancing by herself in a concert parking lot, wearing a boc shirt. i tried my best game on her and she just looked at me and said "ORANGE" over and over until i had to walk back to my van and ask her to help me move a couch into it.

  On 9/27/2013 at 3:38 AM, wabby said:

 

  On 9/26/2013 at 5:18 AM, LimpyLoo said:

 

I don't understand this. Can you give an example or be more concrete, maybe?

 

 

but anyway,

Chromaticism is all about passing from target-note to target-note

(the target notes are often chord-tones)

using chromatic fragments

 

so an example of bebop fragments over Cmaj7

 

would be like B-Bb-A-Ab-G

or D-Db-C-D-B-A-Ab-F#-G-E

 

an important concept in all this is Harmonic Rhythm

whereby strong notes (mostly) land on strong beats (aka downbeats)

and weak notes (mostly) land on weak beats (aka upbeats)

 

when a melody sounds or feels somehow off

it often has to do with Harmonic Rhythm

 

anyway...

Hmm, the way harmonic rhythm influences melody is something worth looking into, thanks for that.

 

When I was referring to memory, there might be a better way to talk about it. But for example, in regard to the Cmaj7 there are only 4 four notes that are chord tones, the other intervals used to form a scale, the 2nd, 4th and 6th are indeterminate. Those intervals would have an importance somewhere in between strong and weak notes, so might sometimes be used on a down beat otherwise the options would become too limited. The Cmaj7 chord is unlikely to appear in isolation within a composition, so the 2nd, 4th and 6th degrees used will often be consistent with the tones from chords that come before the Cmaj7. This makes for smoother modal transitions, but if you're always being consistent with a series of previous chords then it gets limiting and predictable as well. That's why I refer to a kind of 'short-term-memory'.

 

Also, this might be a separate issue but think about moving in an simple interval pattern that goes down a 5th then up a major 4th and repeat. This uses major triadic intervals rather than semi-tones but in a way, isn't it a kind of chromaticism too? Since if you continue you'll very quickly hit all 12 notes? This is like the most extreme form of 'short-term-memory' where you could think of a root note constantly shifting.

 

So chromaticism might simply mean 'passing notes' for moving about in an improvisational way, but doesn't it have all sorts of other effects while you do this? Any short series of notes is a series of intervals that could be thought of in various scalar relationships and every note briefly forms a chord with what ever else is going on!

 

So! I'm not sure if I have question about all this lol.. I mainly wanted to say, yes, more of this talk in ETK would be great. I want to learn the terminology for discussing these subversive interval tricks as I've begun to discover they are the main thing that makes for interesting harmonies and melodies, to my ears anyway.

 

Well I was just saying that Harmonic Rhythm and Chromaticism were just windows into understanding bebop. The two concepts are so fundamental to bebop that they at the heart of the Bebop Scale:

C-B-A-Ab-G-F-E-D-C

C-D-E-F-G-G#-A-B-C

This idea can be applied to any scale or mode, 7-note or otherwise.

And you'd be right that Harmonic Rhythm is limited/limiting if you were to rigidly assign only chord tones to strong beats, but that's not the really idea. Sticking with the Cmaj7 idea, our 'strong' note could be D or F# or A. 'Target note' is probably a better term.

So you could have lines like: A-Ab-G-A-F#-F-E-Eb-D

So really the target notes don't have to be chord tones. In fact, if you're into Bartok-esque poly-tonality then any note could be the target note.

Now, where these concepts start to transcend tradition bebop vocabulary is when you start using chords instead of notes. So take an chord progression that's ever been written in the world, and then before each chord add some passing chord that more-or-less adheres to precepts the functional harmony. So basically that means that some of the tones in the passing chord are either a half-step above or below the tones of the target chord. And the beautiful thing is, as long as you voice lead everything then you can get away with some pretty crazy stuff.

  On 9/27/2013 at 4:27 AM, LimpyLoo said:

Now, where these concepts start to transcend tradition bebop vocabulary is when you start using chords instead of notes. So take an chord progression that's ever been written in the world, and then before each chord add some passing chord that more-or-less adheres to precepts the functional harmony. So basically that means that some of the tones in the passing chord are either a half-step above or below the tones of the target chord. And the beautiful thing is, as long as you voice lead everything then you can get away with some pretty crazy stuff.

Yeah that's the good shit! I'd like to learn more about approaches to passing chords. When I think about that, I think of Herbie Hancock and all the weird chords he quickly shunts in between while going up and down the keyboard. These transitory steps would be the basis of a composition for just about anyone else.

  On 9/27/2013 at 4:23 AM, zaphod said:

that's how boc fans reject people. i saw a girl with dreads and pit hair dancing by herself in a concert parking lot, wearing a boc shirt. i tried my best game on her and she just looked at me and said "ORANGE" over and over until i had to walk back to my van and ask her to help me move a couch into it.

lol

Flol!!! Bullet dodged mate, sounds like she had special needs.

Vitamin C?

oh yeah she just wanted an orange, next time you approach a female make sure you are equipped with a full compliment of fruits.

  On 9/11/2013 at 11:35 PM, CharlesWatkins said:

The reason I signed up for this forum back in December was cause I thought it was going to be music-centric. I have found some cool stuff here, but something has always struck a strange chord with me here, and I guess it's the sense that in spite of how awesome EKT is, the majority of posts and posters here seem to not concern themselves or what they post with music whatsoever.

 

I guess my question then is, why waste your time then? What's the point of filling up a forum that is supposed to be music-centric with mindless nonsense? The only rationale I can derive, is that people just want to feel loved and part of something.

 

Please correct me if I am wrong.

I have quite an obvious point to make that (maybe?) no-one has made yet.

This forum being called WATMM might suggest to people (who dont know the history of the site) that it literally is a forum for people who are music makers.

And it is a bit. But primarily its an aphex twin fan site that has morphed into a sortof long standing community of people who mostly talk bollocks.

So if you were really expecting this to be a music production forum you would be kindof surprised by the amount of General Banter that goes on.

So perhaps this Mr Charles Watkins has just made that mistake.

To prevent this happening in future I propose we change the site name to:

We Used To Be Aphex Twin Fans And We Sortof Still Are But These Days Theres Lot Of Other Good Music And Mostly We Just Like To Talk Bollocks

http://forum.WUTBATFAWSSABTDTLOOGMAMWJLTTB.com

I checked and the domain is available.

sounds good .. but watmm is also a quote from charlie and the chocolate factory .. and we are the music makers in that context has a more philosophical dimension to it not necessarily specific to music creation ..

  On 9/27/2013 at 12:41 PM, MadameChaos said:

oh yeah she just wanted an orange, next time you approach a female make sure you are equipped with a full compliment of fruits.

  On 9/11/2013 at 11:55 PM, hello spiral said:

I still can't recommend enough Charles' Aphex Twin Music Video posted above.

it truly is beautiful.

  On 10/1/2013 at 2:25 AM, dylanmcknd said:

 

  On 9/11/2013 at 11:55 PM, hello spiral said:

I still can't recommend enough Charles' Aphex Twin Music Video posted above.

it truly is beautiful.

 

flol

ah charlie watkins