French mag Charlie Hebdo attacked by gunmen, 12 dead

  On 1/14/2015 at 1:59 PM, k h o v said:

get rid of fucking dignity

Yeah what the hell let's all take MDMA and touch each other intimately in French night clubs I'm all up for that really, whatever

  On 1/14/2015 at 1:37 PM, lin said:

 

  On 1/14/2015 at 1:34 PM, drome said:

 

Fuck politics ignorance on the internet.

 

fixed.

Fixed.

  On 1/14/2015 at 2:24 PM, Timothy Forward said:

 

  On 1/14/2015 at 1:37 PM, lin said:

 

  On 1/14/2015 at 1:34 PM, drome said:

Fuck Watch politics ignorance cat vids on the internet.

fixed.

 

Fixed.

 

Fixed.

lol

yeah, fuck cats, maaaaaaaan, sneaky wankers

  On 1/14/2015 at 11:55 AM, White Rainbow said:

 

  On 1/14/2015 at 11:22 AM, Brian Tregaskin said:

thierry meyssan about the "republican march", charlie hebdo etc.: http://www.voltairenet.org/article186458.html

Thierry Meyssan is a douchebag who see conspiracy everywhere. Why do you relay these informations?

 

We live in the golden age of mental confusion where this kind of fellow just make a living out of these sort of hazy kind of claim.

 

Lot of "weak" people follow these jerks just because they cast doubt on "official" statement. But they should learn to think by themselves and seeking the root causing of their own ignorance rather than listening any guru in the web who claim to know more than anyone else.

 

yeah right. i've been brainwashed by gurus because i can't think by myself. i'm such a sheep. *yawns*

a short 8/9min intro-piece by Professor Raymond Williams (rip), one of Britain's most insightful culture critics, addressing choice, fairness & outcomes

The amount of "MOCKING BELIEFS / DISRESPECTFUL SATIRE IS NOT FREEDOM OF SPEECH" comments and tweets I'm seeing is really baffling. I'd like to see them live in a place where those rights are actually taken away, and see if they like it.

Gun Owners Participate In Simulation Of Paris Massacre

"Still got killed but did better than I thought I would"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJGQfhYWpa4

  On 1/14/2015 at 8:32 PM, manmower said:

Gun Owners Participate In Simulation Of Paris Massacre

 

"Still got killed but did better than I thought I would"

Man practicing open carry law robbed of gun.

Open Carry loons confound me. I'm glad at don't work at the TX Capitol anymore, they've been showing up a lot with their usual "ITS MAH RITE TO DUN CARRY DIS HERE AR-15 AND PROTECT U IN MY FANTASY WORLD"

thing i miss most about America is Bob Evans microwavable biscuits n mthrfkin gravy

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2015/01/14/days-hosting-massive-free-speech-march-france-arrests-comedian-facebook-comments/

  Quote

 

Forty-eight hours after hosting a massive march under the banner of free expression, France opened a criminal investigation of a controversial French comedian for a Facebook post he wrote about the Charlie Hebdo attack, and then this morning, arrested him for that post on charges of “defending terrorism.” The comedian, Dieudonné (above), previously sought elective office in France on what he called an “anti-Zionist” platform, has had his show banned by numerous government officials in cities throughout France, and has been criminally prosecuted several times before for expressing ideas banned in that country.

The apparently criminal viewpoint he posted on Facebook declared: “Tonight, as far as I’m concerned, I feel like Charlie Coulibaly.” Investigators concluded that this was intended to mock the “Je Suis Charlie” slogan and express support for the perpetrator of the Paris supermarket killings (whose last name was “Coulibaly”). Expressing that opinion is evidently a crime in the Republic of Liberté, which prides itself on a line of 20th Century intellectuals – from Sartre and Genet to Foucault and Derrida – whose hallmark was leaving no orthodoxy or convention unmolested, no matter how sacred.

Belgian anti-terror raid in Verviers 'leaves two dead'

  Quote

A source in the mayor's office told AFP news agency that "an operation is under way". Another official said the raid was "jihadist-related".

 

Unconfirmed reports said raids were also taking place in Brussels and elsewhere in Belgium.

 

In Verviers, witnesses reported hearing heavy gunfire for several minutes and at least three explosions.

 

The area around the train station has been cordoned off and reports on social media say there is a heavy police presence in the town centre.

 

Media reports suggested those targeted were suspected jihadists who had returned from Syria.

  On 1/15/2015 at 8:02 PM, John Ehrlichman said:

 

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2015/01/14/days-hosting-massive-free-speech-march-france-arrests-comedian-facebook-comments/

 

 

  Quote

 

Forty-eight hours after hosting a massive march under the banner of free expression, France opened a criminal investigation of a controversial French comedian for a Facebook post he wrote about the Charlie Hebdo attack, and then this morning, arrested him for that post on charges of “defending terrorism.” The comedian, Dieudonné (above), previously sought elective office in France on what he called an “anti-Zionist” platform, has had his show banned by numerous government officials in cities throughout France, and has been criminally prosecuted several times before for expressing ideas banned in that country.

The apparently criminal viewpoint he posted on Facebook declared: “Tonight, as far as I’m concerned, I feel like Charlie Coulibaly.” Investigators concluded that this was intended to mock the “Je Suis Charlie” slogan and express support for the perpetrator of the Paris supermarket killings (whose last name was “Coulibaly”). Expressing that opinion is evidently a crime in the Republic of Liberté, which prides itself on a line of 20th Century intellectuals – from Sartre and Genet to Foucault and Derrida – whose hallmark was leaving no orthodoxy or convention unmolested, no matter how sacred.

 

fuck that guy = complete holocaust denier & started a ridiculous salute trend gesture aimed @ the tribe.

If he's been caught up the back-draft of Paris then tough tits mate, you live by the firmament you get blown down sometimes.

  On 1/14/2015 at 8:02 PM, ThatSpanishGuy said:

Nobody Expects the Spanish Inquisition Teller writes that:

 

"DISRESPECTFUL SATIRE IS NOT FREEDOM OF SPEECH"

  On 1/15/2015 at 9:47 PM, cwmbrancity said:

 

  On 1/15/2015 at 8:02 PM, John Ehrlichman said:

 

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2015/01/14/days-hosting-massive-free-speech-march-france-arrests-comedian-facebook-comments/

 

 

  Quote

 

Forty-eight hours after hosting a massive march under the banner of free expression, France opened a criminal investigation of a controversial French comedian for a Facebook post he wrote about the Charlie Hebdo attack, and then this morning, arrested him for that post on charges of “defending terrorism.” The comedian, Dieudonné (above), previously sought elective office in France on what he called an “anti-Zionist” platform, has had his show banned by numerous government officials in cities throughout France, and has been criminally prosecuted several times before for expressing ideas banned in that country.

The apparently criminal viewpoint he posted on Facebook declared: “Tonight, as far as I’m concerned, I feel like Charlie Coulibaly.” Investigators concluded that this was intended to mock the “Je Suis Charlie” slogan and express support for the perpetrator of the Paris supermarket killings (whose last name was “Coulibaly”). Expressing that opinion is evidently a crime in the Republic of Liberté, which prides itself on a line of 20th Century intellectuals – from Sartre and Genet to Foucault and Derrida – whose hallmark was leaving no orthodoxy or convention unmolested, no matter how sacred.

 

 

 

fuck that guy = complete holocaust denier & started a ridiculous salute trend gesture aimed @ the tribe.

 

If he's been caught up the back-draft of Paris then tough tits mate, you live by the firmament you get blown down sometimes.

 

this post is why i'm glad to be living in the united states even though our government is fucked in many ways. at least we can say what we want for the most part. the moment you start limiting unpopular, shitty opinions is the moment when the government will begin to frame other opinions as unpopular or shitty based on the motives of politicians.

you clearly have no idea who that "man" is & thus fed into the misconception that Americans are lacking in understanding the world & global politics beyond domestic borders.

to call Dieudonné a comedian is comedy in itself - he is an instigator of hate-crimes against Jews, he has not only denied the full extent of the holocaust but he has also openly questioned the illegitamcy of violence AGAINST Jews.

there is freedom of speech & there is openly condoning true hate.

word of advice in the future,,,,,,,,,read

  On 1/15/2015 at 11:54 PM, Hoodie said:

 

this post is why i'm glad to be living in the united states even though our government is fucked in many ways. at least we can say what we want for the most part. the moment you start limiting unpopular, shitty opinions is the moment when the government will begin to frame other opinions as unpopular or shitty based on the motives of politicians.

 

Yeah I'm baffled and perplexed by France's laws. I heard on NPR's Here and Now that a few years ago a comedian was arrested for hate speech based on a joke that was a bad pun. Something involving a Muslim "superhero" that flys/bombs things or something.

Apparently these laws have been on the books long enough to be routinely enforced with plenty of court cases to establish guidelines, but that said the application of them is a very slippery slope, as it's application is arbitrary if it's done at the command of the central government in the form of a "crackdown."

I don't like this Dieudonné guy but I can also say he would not be arrested in the U.S. In this country free speech's consequences are either:

1. the public

2. the media and those behind them that can fire the trigger on your career

3. (both)

It's not exactly more fair but it's a far more reasonable alternative to laws in other countries on the matter. As Hoodie said, our system is fucked in many ways, but that's one thing about our Constitution I'm grateful for. Here, unless your inciting violence against a group, hate speech is free speech. Words are dangerous but censorship is always more so.

  On 1/16/2015 at 12:17 AM, cwmbrancity said:

you clearly have no idea who that "man" is & thus fed into the misconception that Americans are lacking in understanding the world & global politics beyond domestic borders.

 

to call Dieudonné a comedian is comedy in itself - he is an instigator of hate-crimes against Jews, he has not only denied the full extent of the holocaust but he has also openly questioned the illegitamcy of violence AGAINST Jews.

 

there is freedom of speech & there is openly condoning true hate.

 

word of advice in the future,,,,,,,,,read

it appears you're the ignorant one in this situation. i'm fully aware that dieudonne is a racist and i never said he was a comedian (i guess you just assumed i did because many of the headlines call him that). i read about his arrest yesterday, so i understand the nuances of his arrest and the laws behind it.

however, in the united states, we support the rights of racist hate groups like the ku klux klan and westboro baptist church to voice their opinions and even publicly protest, because our bill of rights does not allow the government to interfere with speech unless the speech specifically causes an immediate danger (like yelling "fire" in a movie theater) or threatens direct harm. of course, the government is always trying to find loopholes in this to expand power, including stripping public school students of their constitutional rights, but for the most part, the system has been working pretty well for us. instead of having the government step in when people say things we don't like, americans usually engage in counter-protest or clever boycotts as a form of social norm enforcement.

this is why you will see many americans disagreeing with the arrest. i know it was justified by french laws and the french definition of freedom of speech is different from our definition, but i hope after my explanation you understand why it might seem backwards to people familiar with freedom of speech as defined by the united states. and by the way, you don't need to be condescending because i'm american. thanks.

  On 1/16/2015 at 12:19 AM, joshuatx said:

 

  On 1/15/2015 at 11:54 PM, Hoodie said:

 

this post is why i'm glad to be living in the united states even though our government is fucked in many ways. at least we can say what we want for the most part. the moment you start limiting unpopular, shitty opinions is the moment when the government will begin to frame other opinions as unpopular or shitty based on the motives of politicians.

 

 

unless your inciting violence against a group, hate speech is free speech. Words are dangerous but censorship is always more so.

 

This is my point exactly - he's been inciting violence in France against a group and for far far too long.

if he had pulled this "act" in the States he wouldnt have even got an entry-visa, you even denied a visa to Sebastian Horsley on the grounds of moral turpitude!

this guy is a complete cunt who has been thumping the drum of antisemitism for far far too long. it is vicious, bile-spewn hate, not satire or irony or "fuck the Jew out of me" Larry David parodying. If you live by those codes then you should expect a proverbial slap and i'm amazed he wasnt arrested earlier in his career.

This is no "artist" caught in the cross-fire, this is someone exploiting a massacre to foreground an anti-semtic agenda.

Fuck that.

  On 1/16/2015 at 12:40 AM, cwmbrancity said:

This is my point exactly - he's been inciting violence in France against a group and for far far too long.

if he had pulled this "act" in the States he wouldn't have even got an entry-visa, you even denied a visa to Sebastian Horsley on the grounds of moral turpitude!

 

The US is fucking weird with visas and moral laws, that isn't exactly a apt comparison.

By inciting violence I mean leading a mob to destroy property or assault people, or organizing or conspiring to attack people or a place. This guy is a massive troll more than anything else. The more I read about him the more I loathe the guy and completely understand why you and others despise the guy, (he has allies in the far right, so he's immediately someone I don't like) but I can't find anything beyond offensive and ire-provoking rhetoric. That would not be illegal in this country.

  On 1/16/2015 at 12:39 AM, Hoodie said:

 

  On 1/16/2015 at 12:17 AM, cwmbrancity said:

you clearly have no idea who that "man" is & thus fed into the misconception that Americans are lacking in understanding the world & global politics beyond domestic borders.

 

to call Dieudonné a comedian is comedy in itself - he is an instigator of hate-crimes against Jews, he has not only denied the full extent of the holocaust but he has also openly questioned the illegitamcy of violence AGAINST Jews.

 

there is freedom of speech & there is openly condoning true hate.

 

word of advice in the future,,,,,,,,,read

 

it appears you're the ignorant one in this situation. i'm fully aware that dieudonne is a racist and i never said he was a comedian (i guess you just assumed i did because many of the headlines call him that). i read about his arrest yesterday, so i understand the nuances of his arrest and the laws behind it.

 

however, in the united states, we support the rights of racist hate groups like the ku klux klan and westboro baptist church to voice their opinions and even publicly protest, because our bill of rights does not allow the government to interfere with speech unless the speech specifically causes an immediate danger (like yelling "fire" in a movie theater) or threatens direct harm. of course, the government is always trying to find loopholes in this to expand power, including stripping public school students of their constitutional rights, but for the most part, the system has been working pretty well for us. instead of having the government step in when people say things we don't like, americans usually engage in counter-protest or clever boycotts as a form of social norm enforcement.

 

this is why you will see many americans disagreeing with the arrest. i know it was justified by french laws and the french definition of freedom of speech is different from our definition, but i hope after my explanation you understand why it might seem backwards to people familiar with freedom of speech as defined by the united states. and by the way, you don't need to be condescending because i'm american. thanks.

 

We're not going to agree on these points.

I've lived in France for more than a few years in the recent past and if you asked any educated French person about the tenability of Dieudonné's position they'd immediately throw their hands up with "what can we do?" exasperation. That may sound like "all my mates are black" kinda blanket statement, but i've had enough direct experience of conversations on this topic to have at least some insight.

You seem to forget that Europe has a "history" of ultra-right wing agitators going on to "bigger things". Many Americans have paid with their lives for the mistakes European governments have made in not getting on top of these groups adequately. Yes he's a Muslim, but antisemtic attacks against Jews are on the rise in a big way across the continent now. Commentators blame the recession. Bollix to that. Plenty of people have dubious opinions, but when you're the "tip" of a dangerous iceberg that advocates violence against Jewish men women & children, no amount of free-speech rhetoric is going to cut it imho. The examples you made are definitely fringe/nutter organizations and on this side of the pond the right-wing is a lot more organized, even with this Dieudonné cunt representing an Islamic version of this.

Violence has resulted directly from his posturing, so this isnt "God hates fags" bs.

And i said the misconception of ignorance because i've lived in the US for quite a while too, so its necessary to highlight that i understand fully the respective sets of trans-Atlantic perspectives

  On 1/16/2015 at 12:57 AM, joshuatx said:

 

  On 1/16/2015 at 12:40 AM, cwmbrancity said:

This is my point exactly - he's been inciting violence in France against a group and for far far too long.

if he had pulled this "act" in the States he wouldn't have even got an entry-visa, you even denied a visa to Sebastian Horsley on the grounds of moral turpitude!

 

 

I can't find anything beyond offensive and ire-provoking rhetoric. That would not be illegal in this country.

 

it fuckin should be because it has fed directly into the rise iof antisemitic hate-crimes

edit: learn to spell <----directed @ myself ;)

simmer down, darling.