Go Corbyn

  On 12/26/2019 at 1:28 AM, droid said:

Corbyn's policies are generally very popular in the UK.

they weren't though, people saw through it and didn't trust corbyn. the nationalisation of rail was probably his most popular policy, but still there are many people who doubted it would improve anything, and also many people who remembered the rail service when it used to be nationalised and was badly run. but I will concede that rail nationalisation, if done correctly, is generally a popular policy.

the whole free broadband thing, and all the other very costly policies were pie in the sky, and the electorate knew it. the messaging on the doorstep was one of huge distrust in corbyn (and most of his team), and a real fear that his radical agenda would cause more damage to the UK than brexit. he was seen as worse and less trustworthy than boris - that's got to tell you something. people by and large disliked corbyn and didn't believe in him.

  On 12/26/2019 at 11:22 AM, BCM said:

 

 

they weren't though, people saw through it and didn't trust corbyn. the nationalisation of rail was probably his most popular policy, but still there are many people who doubted it would improve anything, and also many people who remembered the rail service when it used to be nationalised and was badly run. but I will concede that rail nationalisation, if done correctly, is generally a popular policy.

the whole free broadband thing, and all the other very costly policies were pie in the sky, and the electorate knew it. the messaging on the doorstep was one of huge distrust in corbyn (and most of his team), and a real fear that his radical agenda would cause more damage to the UK than brexit. he was seen as worse and less trustworthy than boris - that's got to tell you something. people by and large disliked corbyn and didn't believe in him.

 

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Yeah - they kinda were though. 

  Quote

In late November pollsters YouGov asked the British public questions about the popularity of Labour’s manifesto, published earlier in the month.

The tax rises on the rich were very popular. The 50 per cent tax rate for earnings over £123,000 was supported by 64 per cent of voters, with just 20 per cent opposed and 16 per cent uncertain.

The 45 per cent rate for earnings over £80,000 was popular: 60 per cent supported  it and  23 per cent opposed it.

56 per cent support nationalising railways and just 22 per cent opposed it. Water companies’ nationalisation attracted 50 per cent support and just 25 per cent opposition.

Nationalising Openreach, and therefore broadband, attracted 32 per cent supporting and 31 per cent opposition -but  free broadband for all attracted 62 per cent support and 22 per cent opposition.

https://villagemagazine.ie/index.php/2019/12/18398/

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The '17 manifesto pledges were even more popular in some cases.

https://www.businessinsider.com/poll-huge-public-support-for-jeremy-corbyns-manifesto-promises-2017-5?r=US&IR=T

These numbers are unusually high for economic policy pledges from any party. 

I would agree that there were serious issues with messaging, and this was highlighted by a large contingent of Labour activists during the campaign, but it seems that based on the available data its fair to say that Labour's policies over the last two election campaigns have been unusually popular. That's not really a huge surprise considering this agenda are more or less in line with moderate social democratic policies in most European countries and only seem radical in the context of the UK's political environment, which is amongst one of the most neo liberal on the planet. 



 

nice

I'm kinda glad this happened tbh.

So much Tory bashing online recently (obviously most of it justified) but the left is just as toxic a place to be in politics.

Politics in general needs a great big kick up the ass

  On 10/29/2020 at 2:59 PM, caze said:

nice

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Saw this earlier, though haven't looked fully yet at what's available in today's news cycle about the report. 

However, I did see that Ken Livingstone was called out in particular too. 

Can somebody rename the thread Gone Corbyn

you lived, laughed and cried. three quid well spent.

Absolute useless weasel of a man. I’m sure his cult followers are still denying he’s done anything wrong. 

Edited October 29, 2020 by beerwolf

 

 

The most amusing part is that it was the Labour party that set up this independent watchdog in the first place. The BNP are the only other party that have been investigated.

 

James O’Brien was saying how utterly devastated he was that the Labour Party could be involved in such bigotry. How was it even possible? 
 

The further you go to the left sooner or later you’ll appear on the right.

Edit (to be fair to him, he was never a Corbyn supporter and was highly critical of him)

Edited October 30, 2020 by beerwolf

  On 10/30/2020 at 6:30 AM, beerwolf said:

The further you go to the left sooner or later you’ll appear on the right.

I'm not going to comment on recent takes regarding Corbyn and Labour, I'm way too out of the loop, but when I was reading about this a year ago the general impression I got was Labor's problematic elements were being overblown and conflated into the whole "anti-Israeli = anti-Semitic" trend that's rampant here in the states.

The huge irony is while the Labour is actually trying to address their issues with alleged anti-Semitism the Tories, the BNP, and the bulk of the undercurrents behind Brexit and right-wing populism in the UK, Europe and the US are literally pushing the core of anti-Semitic ideology with the same dog-whistles and rhetoric as the fascists of the past: globalist conspiracies, wealthy elite like Soros, cultural Marxism, etc. That's the shit to worry about and scrutinize. 

Also for the record horseshoe theory is bunk and the fishhook theory a lot more pertinent to far more political scenarios historically. While I don't like authoritarian left much as an ideology it's a different beast than authoritarian right ideology.

Edited October 30, 2020 by joshuatxuk

Excellent post as always joshuatxuk.

Sometimes I wish I had your quality control

Thats my political comments for the year done and dusted! My usual philosophy of not getting involved in political debates now must be implemented!

  On 10/30/2020 at 6:54 AM, joshuatxuk said:

Also for the record horseshoe theory is bunk

Calling a simple reductionist graphic representation a "theory" gives this idea more credit than it deserves, imo.

His fantastic leadership of Labour was reminiscent of...

Just at the moment the world is so divided. It’s making me weary. What with America at each other’s throat, and the lunatic circus that has turned into. Then there’s this far-left faction of Labour who follow Corbyn and are so intolerant of anyone who don’t hold the same opinion as them they are even instigating some civil war, within their own party. 
 

It’s just not good at this moment in time. In my humble opinion. It’s like there is some dark spell being weaved upon us. When we need to work together, the complete opposite seems to be happening.

*sighs*

 

 

Edited October 30, 2020 by beerwolf

Beerwolf. Have you ever considered not being such a fucking simpleton?

Publicly criticise Israeli treatment of the Palestinian’s and you will be subjected to a vindictive smear campaign. That’s the moral of this story.

No, what happened here was Jews in the party were being harassed, people who have nothing to do with Israel, and certainly nothing to do with the treatment of Palestinians. And when people complained about this, assholes like you would downplay it and link it to criticism of Israel, linking everything any Jew does with Israel is of course itself anti-Semitic. 

  On 10/31/2020 at 12:56 PM, caze said:

No, what happened here was Jews in the party were being harassed, people who have nothing to do with Israel, and certainly nothing to do with the treatment of Palestinians. And when people complained about this, assholes like you would downplay it and link it to criticism of Israel, linking everything any Jew does with Israel is of course itself anti-Semitic. 

Asshole eh? Steady on cazey.

Yes my statement was hyperbolic, but that’s the core of the issue.

I’m not condoning proper anti-semitism. If people can’t openly criticise injustice - you know, people with hearts who feel concern for the persecuted, who themselves labelled as racists by pointing out racism towards the Palenstians -then resentment will grow.

Tory Islamaphobia is apparently acceptable and goes largely unchecked, while these so called anti-semites in the Labour Party are absolutely pilloried by the media.

The tories are piling in for political point scoring, as disingenuous as ever, bless em. No doubt many among their ranks are secretly anti-semitic - as rife as it is in the British establishment.

It’s fucked.

If all those involved were given a fair shot to air their grievances and could work together towards getting justice for all then we might get somewhere.

Edited October 31, 2020 by drome

I think we all need a nice hot mug of cocoa and sing kumbaya round the campfire 

While it is true that critique of Israel's right-wing government is often labelled as anti-semitic as a means of discrediting a political opponent in a smear campaign, and that islamophobia is widely accepted compared to antisemitism which is sort of hypocritical, there actually is such a thing as real antisemitism. In all parties.

  On 10/30/2020 at 7:59 AM, beerwolf said:

Excellent post as always joshuatxuk.

Sometimes I wish I had your quality control

Thats my political comments for the year done and dusted! My usual philosophy of not getting involved in political debates now must be implemented!

I think your post was in good faith I really wanted to make sure I wasn't targeting you in particular. Politics is a nasty business, it's frustratingly hard to casually follow and navigate. 

It is indeed nasty business. I think that’s why it suits others and not me. My once upon a time lovely sister lately has turned into a right cunt. Since she shacked up with a Tory Cocksucker all she does is march around spewing forth political hellfire and brimstone. In the name of God what happened to you?

She and her money worshipping twat of a husband can also fuck off.

I’m gonna get myself a donkey a surfboard and a fishing rod and travel the Atlantic Coast of Peru. Catch some waves and hopefully a fish or three. 
 

Have fun amigos

Edited October 31, 2020 by beerwolf

  On 10/31/2020 at 9:16 PM, beerwolf said:

I’m gonna get myself a donkey a surfboard and a fishing rod and travel the Atlantic Pacific Coast of Peru.

right attitude, good idea, wrong ocean 

incidentally I'm chilling on the coast the weekend after the election myself for a couple days