thank you Sean and Rob

! we need new >supercollider vs max< thread

*waits for it to happen*

*functionfives watmm*

  On 12/29/2015 at 12:17 PM, phling said:

it is just fucking stupid.

if this boxes-with-wires thing would be any good, we would all be programming this way.

but just a small bunch of people who *think* they are better off doing it this way are actually doing it this way, and they live on a small island jerking each or off.

 

granted, there are some domains where a visual/spatial signal graph is a useful interaction model, namely audio routings...

but using this same abstraction model for general logic is just dumb.

 

tldr: you're better off with an actual programming language.

i think you can now write code on Max with JavaScript and C. Robert Henke's Lumiere software is made in Max but written on C, apparently.

hmmm. I've written my own laser engine and it's actually better than Henke's which seems to be limited to rendering basic circles and lines mostly. This stuff's not exactly rocket science and let's face it: Henke's stuff kinda sucks, he just knows how to talk it up.

  On 12/29/2015 at 12:17 PM, phling said:

tldr: you're better off with an actual programming language.

  On 12/29/2015 at 12:17 PM, phling said:

there are some domains where a visual/spatial signal graph is a useful interaction model, namely audio routings...

 

I agree that things quickly get awkward as you start to do more elaborate logic or implementing common algorithms or data structures. But, as mentioned, that's where JavaScript and gen come in handy.

  On 12/30/2015 at 2:43 AM, xox said:

! we need new >supercollider vs max< thread

 

*waits for it to happen*

 

*functionfives watmm*

http://forum.watmm.com/topic/75885-maxmsp-pure-data-supercollider-chuck/ close enough?

  On 12/31/2015 at 3:13 PM, sweepstakes said:

 

  On 12/30/2015 at 2:43 AM, xox said:

! we need new >supercollider vs max< thread

 

*waits for it to happen*

 

*functionfives watmm*

http://forum.watmm.com/topic/75885-maxmsp-pure-data-supercollider-chuck/ close enough?

 

yes, yes, good enough... i remember that one. we can continue overthere.

p.s. phling, you still hadn't showed me your music or music from someone else that was made by using a 'proper' programming lang only, music that couldn't be done with propellerhead's reason more easily. (couldn't have been done? english!!!)

Yeah, let's hear that!

I'm not code averse in any way, but Max is great for what it is, and if it's good enough for Autechre, who am I to turn my nose up at it, right?

I made the "proper" language argument before too but I don't feel that way anymore. It's apples and oranges. They complement each other nicely. Choose the right tool for the job, and sometimes that's going to be patching.

Learning Max/MSP...that's my 2016 New Year's resolution. A cliché excuse, I know

i lobe max <3

sorry I don't intend to hijack this thread...

one last thing:

with something like C++ as a skill you can build your own Max/MSP. Clearly learning C++ is overkill if you just wanna make tunes. But then, for that, why not just use Ableton and some VSTs, or a Banjo.

The thing about Max that gets me worked up (besides simply getting mad at it real quick each time I give it a spin) is that it's the de facto "programming environment" for electronic music, but it's conceptually so up its own ass. Basically with whatever programming language you learn, you will realise that other (sane) programming languages are usually quite similar and easy to pick up. whereas with Max, you end up learning crazy stuff which is only valid in Max land.

as for my own stuff, I don't really record tunes. But here's a thing I made with code:

STROM on the App Store - iTunes - Apple

Right now I'm developing my own little programming language which is the craziest thing I've done ever, but it's fun.

Just saying this to emphasize that I've been exploring language & human/computer interfaces a bit for some time now.

I love you phling

  On 1/1/2016 at 7:04 PM, phling said:

sorry I don't intend to hijack this thread...

one last thing:

 

with something like C++ as a skill you can build your own Max/MSP. Clearly learning C++ is overkill if you just wanna make tunes. But then, for that, why not just use Ableton and some VSTs, or a Banjo.

 

The thing about Max that gets me worked up (besides simply getting mad at it real quick each time I give it a spin) is that it's the de facto "programming environment" for electronic music, but it's conceptually so up its own ass. Basically with whatever programming language you learn, you will realise that other (sane) programming languages are usually quite similar and easy to pick up. whereas with Max, you end up learning crazy stuff which is only valid in Max land.

 

as for my own stuff, I don't really record tunes. But here's a thing I made with code:

STROM on the App Store - iTunes - Apple

 

Right now I'm developing my own little programming language which is the craziest thing I've done ever, but it's fun.

Just saying this to emphasize that I've been exploring language & human/computer interfaces a bit for some time now.

looking neato. so that's in c++? or swift or obv-c?

thanks! :)

this is ca. 80% Objective-C, the rest is C (mostly the audio parts)

here's to Sam & Bob btw, without AE as inspiration I would have never started coding things.

  On 1/1/2016 at 7:04 PM, phling said:

sorry I don't intend to hijack this thread...

one last thing:

 

with something like C++ as a skill you can build your own Max/MSP. Clearly learning C++ is overkill if you just wanna make tunes. But then, for that, why not just use Ableton and some VSTs, or a Banjo.

 

The thing about Max that gets me worked up (besides simply getting mad at it real quick each time I give it a spin) is that it's the de facto "programming environment" for electronic music, but it's conceptually so up its own ass. Basically with whatever programming language you learn, you will realise that other (sane) programming languages are usually quite similar and easy to pick up. whereas with Max, you end up learning crazy stuff which is only valid in Max land.

 

as for my own stuff, I don't really record tunes. But here's a thing I made with code:

STROM on the App Store - iTunes - Apple

 

Right now I'm developing my own little programming language which is the craziest thing I've done ever, but it's fun.

Just saying this to emphasize that I've been exploring language & human/computer interfaces a bit for some time now.

Your app looks really nice, and I understand this is the go-to tool for a lot of Analog Rytm users for transferring samples as well.

As far as Max, even if you create your signal and event processing in "real" code, it's still very useful as a routing UI - I haven't seen a better general purpose one. They're not mutually exclusive. But in Max, that's optional - you don't have to have a distinction between that configuration and the more complex processing, and that often lets you experiment and combine things more quickly (which, granted, can lead to poor patch design, but you can also write spaghetti code in any language).

And as far as the transition from Max to a more standard programming language, it's not that big a leap. Gen patches can be exported to C syntax from the patcher. And while event processing is a little trickier, those components can be moved to Javascript without even leaving Max.

Sometimes it's just easier to work with visual abstractions than always working with text, and it often helps with reasoning about the flow.

  On 1/1/2016 at 7:13 PM, delet... said:

I love you phling <3

Look imma just put a few lines, excuse me.

I'm just sort asking myself drunkly; is there a sort of line between getting too caught up in software/programming and coding and shit - to actually making music that we feel and want others to? Seems to me, though how brilliant autechre's output has been lately, that technology is certainly a wonderful tool for music means - but is there any soul there?, and if so - can it be found. Sometimes I tap beats at night against my bed head, and listen through my pillow, it is the most soulful shit! Be it because of what my mind/heart are feeling in that moment, I think programming gets great results, but there's something about doing things from the body out, (no programming or coding or whatever the fuck)

End transmission.

of course there's soul in ae_live. you are drunk

  On 1/11/2016 at 4:12 AM, very honest said:

of course there's soul in ae_live. you are drunk

Yes, I think you missed what I was saying, I never said there was NO soul in AE_LIVE.

You fool

And by fool I meant you beautiful very honest person :-)

THANK YOU PENN AND TELLER

After weeks and weeks of debating the price markup for higher quality (Warp really gets on my bad side w/that), I finally pulled the trigger on 24-bit. Hoooly freaking ear orgy. Thanks S/R!

ty sam n todd

txh Samuel Beath n brock Gorb Bran