2020 US Election

bloombergs a mega bitch, check out this whinging about people doing based artistic praxis on his shit while he's simultaneously doing hundreds of millions of dollars worth of vandalism of his propaganda on the public airwaves

Ok but if he ends up as the nominee I’m gonna fuckin vote for him. 

  On 2/25/2020 at 8:23 AM, Candiru said:

Ok but if he ends up as the nominee I’m gonna fuckin vote for him. 

well yeah. If Bernie loses then the priority for Bernie supporters should be to get Trump out of office.

I've said this a few times, but at least the corporate Democrat won't get rid of the incremental positive changes Obama made. Tho they probably won't get rid of the bad ones...

It sounds so obvious, right?

  On 2/25/2020 at 8:27 AM, goDel said:

It sounds so obvious, right?

Hopefully Pete or Mike, if they win, won't scoff at Bernie supporters as Hillary did. Well, she more ignored them due to the obligatory "right pivot" in the general election.

  On 2/25/2020 at 8:24 AM, Brisbot said:

well yeah. If Bernie loses then the priority for Bernie supporters should be to get Trump out of office. 

That should’ve been our priority either way, and it’s quite possible that Bernie not running at all would’ve been the easiest way to accomplish this, since he’s a much more effective vote splitter than a senator. 

  On 2/25/2020 at 8:37 AM, Candiru said:

That should’ve been our priority either way, and it’s quite possible that Bernie not running at all would’ve been the easiest way to accomplish this, since he’s a much more effective vote splitter than a senator. 

Already had this convo a few pages back. Lol. I doubt Bernie losing this time will stop supporters this time from voting for the boring centrist. It's a very different atmosphere from the 2016 election.

The DNC also shouldn't have supported one of the least liked Democrats among the general population. It's hard to tell what Hillary's personality or actual beliefs are since she basically just told people what they wanted to hear depending on where she was.

If you have to sport a fake southern slur when in the rust belt, or pander to racists with descriptions like "super predators", it's gonna be hard for me to go out and vote for you.

I admire your positivity, bris. I'm afraid I'm a bit more cynical. But I do hope you're right. For humanity's sake.

"let's stop putting people left of center on the ballot, that will get people on the left to go out and vote, if the left wants to win we need to pander to the right, except way worse than the actual right does it"

  On 2/25/2020 at 8:54 AM, goDel said:

I admire your positivity, bris. I'm afraid I'm a bit more cynical. But I do hope you're right. For humanity's sake.

Every Bernie Sanders supporter I have asked has said as much, and many didn't vote in the general in 2016. Obviously anecdotal, but still.

And Dem. politicians in general arn't ignoring Bernie's base. Though it's probably mostly fake, it still doesn't feel like a slight as it did in 2016, to be ignored.

Srsly, Joyrex should have the combine posts thing upped to 5 mins or something.

  On 2/25/2020 at 8:57 AM, Brisbot said:

Every Bernie Sanders supporter I have asked has said as much, and many didn't vote in the general in 2016. Obviously anecdotal, but still.

That's why I'm cynical. I hear way too much "If ...., then I rather not vote". Or worse "If ..., then I'd rather not vote and let Trump win".

Generally speaking, I'm amazed how good people are at rationalising their personal BS. It's astounding. It's like people have been taken over by ideologies and lost their ability of independent thought. The most refreshing opinions nowadays are the ones that go "I don't know". Or the "I don't want to make a quick judgment". It's almost a relief to hear that. As opposed to the ideological driven nonsense.

  On 2/25/2020 at 9:18 AM, goDel said:

That's why I'm cynical. I hear way too much "If ...., then I rather not vote". Or worse "If ..., then I'd rather not vote and let Trump win".

Generally speaking, I'm amazed how good people are at rationalising their personal BS. It's astounding. It's like people have been taken over by ideologies and lost their ability of independent thought. The most refreshing opinions nowadays are the ones that go "I don't know". Or the "I don't want to make a quick judgment". It's almost a relief to hear that. As opposed to the ideological driven nonsense.

posadists rise up its accelerationist time death to murica

Voting in the US seems ridiculously complicated.

if you support any democratic except bernie during the primary, you are betraying the workers, betraying the strength of the laborers, betraying the only chance you have to bring about a real left movement in the US.  if your goal is to just get rid of trump and go back to normal, that's not useful at all.  you should be organizing your workplace if you work at a place with an opportunity, spreading the word about the coming struggle to overcome capitalism, and engaging politically as much as you can, getting your entire family and friend group to vote for him, getting all of them to get everyone they know to vote for him, volunteering for his campaign, spreading class consciousness and a worker organization mindset to everyone you know.  it extends far beyond bernie himself, this is an opportunity to actually achieve what the left should be aiming for, it's a once in a century opportunity, maybe the last one we'll have before we start facing widespread fascism, you think Trump is bad? imagine an actually highly intelligent, organized, and socially suave cryptofascist

It surprises me people are supposed to have their political preference registered. That's the first WTF. Why have a NPP? (It makes sense that you have to be member of a political party to vote in a primary though. No argument there.) Then follow this up with the endless discussion on registries with respect to gun ownership. Registering political preference is apparently a nothing burger. When it comes to guns, it suddenly becomes an important issue. 

  On 2/25/2020 at 10:02 AM, goDel said:

It surprises me people are supposed to have their political preference registered. That's the first WTF. Why have a NPP? (It makes sense that you have to be member of a political party to vote in a primary though. No argument there.) Then follow this up with the endless discussion on registries with respect to gun ownership. Registering political preference is apparently a nothing burger. When it comes to guns, it suddenly becomes an important issue. 

it's a standard voter suppression tactic on the part of the democratic party.  they don't want independents to vote in the primary because they almost all support Bernie.  this happened in the last election too and helped hillary steal the nomination, among other things

  On 2/25/2020 at 7:50 AM, Zeffolia said:

i'm ignorant on the topic, all im saying is its not communist currently regardless of how many adjectives they appended to marxism-leninism-maoism-whateverism.  mao would shoot me for being a liberal or whatever, if they were communist it's not a form i approve of

nothing about them now is communist.  they haven't abolished the state, private property/capital, money, etc.

They definitely are not communist now. You are correct. They definitely were under Mao. 

  On 2/25/2020 at 7:58 AM, Zeffolia said:

plus, the idea that china ever could have successfully jumped to communism is unrealistic, considering they were a peasant farmer society.  marx very clearly outlined the material conditions required to implement communism, and they are conditions of heavy capitalist industrialization and the creation of a supremely advanced means of production, off of which to bootstrap communism.  and he specifically said that the revolution must and would come from the most heavily industrialized technological nation of the time at which it occurs, which in that time period was not China, so their attempts were doomed to fail, they had nothing to bootstrap off of

Marx never foresaw communism arising from peasant agrarian societies, but in virtually all places where communism was undertaken, those are precisely the situations of the workers at the time. It did not occur in any of the industrialized nations where Marx thought it likely to occur, likely due to the simple fact that capitalism and industrialization increased the quality of life for many. 
Marx didn’t foresee a lot of things, and to latch onto solely Marx’s ideas for a progressive movement is not enough to sustain that movement. As I’ve said elsewhere on WATMM Marx provides good value for his economic analysis, but lacks in a lot of other areas. 
Please respond to my other post. You made a lot of claims, please back them up. 
 

Fore the record, I am not American. I also think that a Sanders/Warren ticket would be great for average Americans. Warren can provide that necessary regulation on markets, Sanders can temper the idea of Warren’s wealth tax, and then you guys can work on your foreign policy. 
 

Bernie is much more likely to win if the coronavirus kicks up a few notches and starts fucking with the global economy. 

I’m not a fan of viruses n shit. Just saying 

  On 2/25/2020 at 1:42 PM, Candiru said:

Bernie is much more likely to win if the coronavirus kicks up a few notches and starts fucking with the global economy. 

I’m not a fan of viruses n shit. Just saying 

Gonna love the conspiracy theories if this happens

Wat?

  On 2/25/2020 at 1:51 PM, zkom said:

Gonna love the conspiracy theories if this happens

The ol’ collusion with China flimflam. 

  On 2/25/2020 at 9:48 AM, Squee said:

Voting in the US seems ridiculously complicated.

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California isn't even on of the restrictive states. In many states there are recently passed voter ID laws, which makes it inherently more difficult for working poor and elderly citizens lacking in mobility to vote. Many states purge legally registered voters in mass. Then there's gerrymandering and severely underfunded and under-regulated election resources. The more you dig into the more absurd and infuriating it is.