A Civilized Discussion on Gender Issues

  On 4/17/2013 at 9:18 AM, Zeffolia said:

I don't have a problem with faggots

Insults are meant to be something that I think may cause a person emotional distress

My calling someone a faggot as an insult doesn't necessarily I think faggots are bad, but that the person I am directing that insult at very well may. That's the point of insults sirry.

How can you be this thick? Even if you don't have a problem with gay men - and your sense of masculinity is so perverse and misshapen, I don't believe that for a second - when you use "faggot" as an insult you are legitimising its use as a tool of violence against gay men. You are contributing directly to a violent discourse against some of the most oppressed men in society, bro.

Heterosexual Men's Rights

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goDel pressed the button

critical hit!

  On 4/17/2013 at 9:23 AM, usagi said:

  On 4/17/2013 at 9:15 AM, marf said:

 

 

  On 4/17/2013 at 8:38 AM, lumpenprol said:

 

*fondles Zeffolia's ambiguous genitalia discreetly, pretends it was an accident

 

 

 

lol, jesus..haha

 

reminds me, i recently made friends with an older guy at my local library. one day i googled his name and he came up a sex offender. he was caught fondling his mothers vagina while she was on her death bed. sorry to derail

 

 

 

fucking lol, "sorry to derail". when it's a derailment of this proportion, you never have to be sorry.

Lol, agreed

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So my use of the word faggot is discriminatory against homosexual men and a horrible thing to do, yet the MRA movement with lots of statistical evidence for their cause is "pathetic" ?

Bit contradictory there to first say using a particular word as an insult is so horrible, then to say that even suggesting men are oppressed at all and to support progression towards equality for males, is "pathetic"

  On 4/17/2013 at 9:19 AM, lumpenprol said:

 

  On 4/17/2013 at 9:14 AM, goDel said:

At least listen to John aka awep.

 

wait, john erlichman is awepittance? Mind blown!

Is this a testament to your current lack of sleep? He changed his name in the middle of one of those heated discussions. Quite humorously, I might add.

i feel less ashamed for touching his bum now

Zeff, you have some poor logic. You use the word faggot as an insult without meaning to insult other people who are labelled as faggots? What? And you think you can defend that position?

  On 4/17/2013 at 9:29 AM, Zeffolia said:

So my use of the word faggot is discriminatory against homosexual men and a horrible thing to do, yet the MRA movement with lots of statistical evidence for their cause is "pathetic" ?

 

Bit contradictory there to first say using a particular word as an insult is so horrible, then to say that even suggesting men are oppressed at all and to support progression towards equality for males, is "pathetic"

that logic is the most retarded thing I've ever heard

btw, I hope you have a dream where you fall in love with a woman who has an asshole instead of a mouth

  On 4/17/2013 at 9:34 AM, LimpyLoo said:

 

btw, I hope you have a dream where you fall in love with a woman who has an asshole instead of a mouth

this is destroying me

We might have a woman with an asshole instead of a mouth in our midst.

  On 4/17/2013 at 9:37 AM, goDel said:

We might have a woman with an asshole instead of a mouth in our midst.

*fixes hair*

Where?

Lol

Be patient. Coming out of the closet season is only beginning.

  On 4/17/2013 at 9:32 AM, goDel said:

Zeff, you have some poor logic. You use the word faggot as an insult without meaning to insult other people who are labelled as faggots? What? And you think you can defend that position?

K whatever you win

My personal habits in what insults I choose are irrelevant to the argument though. Even if I didn't believe what I'm saying that doesn't make the argument any more or less valid

Let it stand on its own

Zeff, my final post: this is not about winning. For me it was about honesty, right from the start. Like I've already said, if you don't want to come out that's fine. But please don't try to reason your way out of it by arguing it's irrelevant. We've been through this discussion and you stick to your position. Fine. I'll let it rest from here on out.

Judging from various posts on reddit and youtube, the gender equality discussion is quite toxic often times. Feminists on reddit in /shitredditsays target men in a spiteful way who say anything that could be construed as judgmental, bigoted, racist etc, and mens rights people target women who either get punished for lying about a man, or in general feminists who speak their minds, again in a mean spirited way.

I dunno if it's true but it seems like this discussion has heated up in the past months more so than before.

IMO we can forget about anything fruitful coming from it. this feels like republican vs democrat all over, only division and bubbles will emerge, and seems like they already have.

Gender/sexual orientation of watmmers is irrelevant to the discussion/topic. Why is no one making this argument?

These issues are people issues that deal with culture, religion, governments (as note the differences in gender inequality across different regions).

  On 4/17/2013 at 9:47 AM, goDel said:

Zeff, my final post: this is not about winning. For me it was about honesty, right from the start. Like I've already said, if you don't want to come out that's fine. But please don't try to reason your way out of it by arguing it's irrelevant. We've been through this discussion and you stick to your position. Fine. I'll let it rest from here on out.

What am I supposed to come out about

i've asked you this like 10 times lol

fucking hell has this tread reduced to posting videos of rape? ok yep Im outta here.

yeah what the fuck is going on with WATMM lately

obligatory:

that video is worth its own thread. Shocking stuff.

  On 4/17/2013 at 9:49 AM, coax said:

Feminists on reddit in /shitredditsays target men in a spiteful way who say anything that could be construed as judgmental, bigoted, racist etc, and mens rights people target women who either get punished for lying about a man, or in general feminists who speak their minds, again in a mean spirited way.

WELL then i guess teh truth is somewhere in the middle between feminism and mens rights (im joking) SRS rules MRAs suck

also i think zeff got spermjacked

SPERMJACKED

First off, thanks for coming to the thread, Zeffolia, and for keeping it civil a decent percentage of the time (though I do take issue with your use of "faggot"). Your passion for this issue is quite encouraging of debate.

Encey, Rixx, and Chen, thanks for some epic posts.

Zeffolia, you obviously have a talent for analytical reasoning. What makes debate with you unappealing is that you are unwilling to connect that reasoning to the real world. I do think you've made some important points about systemic unfairness to men in the US. But you also make a lot of bold assertions with no effort to back them up. I appreciate when you back down from misstatements. But your willingness to keep making things up, and your overall dismissiveness of fine logical reasoning, make it hard to take your more interesting views seriously. I do get the feeling that you're deliberately playing devil's advocate because you're bored. A lot of what you're doing is not trolling, but that part is.

Thanks again though, it's been a great pleasure to read! I'm quite humbled by the patience and intellectual prowess in this thread.

A/d, you'd make an awesome moderator!

How the hell did this get to 10 pages in two days?

yeah i also don't understand your insistence on knowing the person's background and agenda godel. zeff brought some arguments, referred to some articles, those have been criticized and reframed and so on. why does it matter if he's trolling/is a misogynist/have been raped by (black) women etc if those don't interfere with his following of the rules of (sort of) scientific argument. does the knowledge of the fact that wagner was an anti-semite objectively affect the quality of his already composed music ?